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Thread: Slduggy - Ban Appeal (Job/Role Ban)

  1. #1
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    Slduggy - Ban Appeal (Job/Role Ban)

    Ban Appeal
    Byond ID?
    Slduggy
    Character Name?
    Grady Molina
    Type of Ban?
    Job/Role Ban
    Admin who banned you (if known)
    Grimcad
    Total Ban Duration
    Permanent
    Remaining Duration
    N/A
    What other servers do you play on?
    FO13 and Paradise
    Are you now or have you been banned on any servers? Which ones?
    No
    Reason for Ban
    In summary I believe both MPs went too far and were too zealous in the enforcing of an order made by the Captain. As both MPs have notes relating to MP issues. Both players in question will receive MP and CMP bans.
    Link to previous appeals for the same ban (if applicable):
    N/A
    Your appeal, including evidence (screenshots, etc)
    I will be referring to the logs pulled from this thread: //showthrea...5-Rule-3/page2

    The thread was closed before I was able to provide any input and I would appreciate if I could get a second look at this ruling, as I believe I was given no opportunity to curb being "overzealous in enforcing orders", and was given noindication that my role candidacy was at risk for my actions within the round.

    Firstly the reason for the ban is as follows: "In summary I believe both MPs went too far and were too zealous in the enforcing of an order made by the Captain. As both MPs have notes relating to MP issues. Both players in question will receive MP and CMP bans. "

    The ruling on which rules were broken is unclear so I will proceed by assuming that Rule 15 was broken in regards to this specific part: "Should there be hostiles in the vicinity, the MP is required to abort the arrest and move to a secure area. "

    The initial incident in which the rule 15 was broken:

    Spoiler Spoiler:


    According to Kennard Davis "In My particular case, I saw my aSL (Pyro Spec) Being attacked by a Ravager/Spitter (Cant remember which), so I moved a bit out of the FOB to assist him and make sure he didn't die"

    The orders I was given were that any marine leaving the FOB was to be charged with insubordination. From my view of this incident there were no active threats to Davis when I tazed them. As you can see from the logs I was able to grab them and drag them behind the barricades one seconds after the tazer connected. They were one tile outside to the barricades and the Ravager they were shooting at was offscreen or in darkness for me, although the slashing of the Pyro spec could be heard. From my judgement Kennard Davis was in no danger when the arrest was performed.

    I had shouted 12 times that no marine is to leave the FOB and I tried to be very careful about not tazing marines who were in any danger for being hurt by xenos. When I was PMed by Sargash about it they said that they saw I was trying to make an effort not to taze marines in combat.

    Spoiler Spoiler:


    From this exchange I presumed that this was an IC issue and had no indication that I was being overzealous with enforcing orders. After tazing Davis I dragged them back to the barricades and did not proceed to arrest them for insub (it is a minor crime and a chose to ignore it) as it would be to disruptive to the operation. Then they threatened me which is a Major crime and they were set to arrest.


    Spoiler Spoiler:


    You can see that immediately after they were set to arrest they engaged the same Ravager again but this time I did not choose to arrest them because they were in danger as I could see the ravager and Kennard fighting it. I waited until they were deep inside the FOB to arrest them. The initial charge applied to them is incorrect because I misspoke. The charge was assault with a deadly weapon and I changed it as soon as I was aware of my mistake.

    Perhaps the enforcement of orders was heavy handed, but at no point did I have any idea that I was breaking sever rules or being overzealous. I tried to be fair by not arresting wounded trying to evac, even though they were technically committing insubordination for being in the FOB.

    Spoiler Spoiler:


    Also not a single marine was arrested for insubordination as a result of pushing when ordered to stay in the FOB. The only people who were arrested were those who committed major crimes such as threatening lethal force.

    Had I arrested wounded for being in the FOB, or had I arrested every marine who was pushing against orders or even if I had been told at some point that my actions were crossing the line I would have agreed with your ruling. I attempted to show restraint by using my megaphone more then my tazer, I believe I only tazed one marine (Kennard Davis) for leaving the fob and yelled at the rest.

    I stayed in the FOB and didn't attempt to chase down any marines who were to far out of it, or attempt to arrest those marines who were actively fighting Xenos.

    In regards to the rule in marine law "Should there be hostiles in the vicinity, the MP is required to abort the arrest and move to a secure area. " When I tazed Davis I firmly believed that they were in no danger and that my actions would not lead them to any harm, as they were in arms reach of me.

    I agree that MPs are not commissars but I don't believe my actions crossed the line. Most of my time at the FOB was spent shouting in the megaphone and I tried to be sparing with the tazer. While I do believe I was being heavy handed with enforcing orders, I don't think I was overzealous. I wish I could have been informed during the round that my role candidacy was at risk so I could make an adjustment, but I feel like I was never given an opportunity to change what I was doing and that the retroactive ban was unfair.

    In regards to my note history, my last MP related note was months ago and was for enforcing marine law on delta level security, as such I don't think its relevant to this incident.

    I hope you can give this a second look, thanks!

  2. #2
    CM-SS13 Vice Host
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    Generally speaking job ban appeals should not be made until you�ve sat on it a while and this was applied within the last 24 hours.
    If you think it was made in haste or inappropriately then a report would be better suited. Regardless, that is not for me to decide.

    I�ll edit in my thoughts on your appeal when I wake up in the morning
    Charles & Arthur Edwinson
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    Record:
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    Alright Ill wait to see what happens, Ill put it up on the report section if this wasn't the right place to put it.

  4. #4
    CM-SS13 Host ThesoldierLLJK's Avatar
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    Notes:

    Spoiler Spoiler:


    I would say this is a normal appeal since the manager already made a decision, so I would just explain your side in more detail here.

  5. #5
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    I mean your last MP note was exactly one year ago, I think you should have been given a warning than a flat out ban.

    I'd atleast say remove your regular MP ban and leave your CMP ban. Hopefully that can show us you can handle it.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bancrose View Post
    I mean your last MP note was exactly one year ago, I think you should have been given a warning than a flat out ban.

    I'd atleast say remove your regular MP ban and leave your CMP ban. Hopefully that can show us you can handle it.
    This basically.
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  7. #7
    CM-SS13 Host ThesoldierLLJK's Avatar
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    I mean looking at the total circumstances, that round was hectic. Yes you guys were over zealous, but at the same time, your last MP note was long ago. As you were not the CMP and thought you were trying to follow orders and do the right thing, I think a warning would have sufficed over a outright JBAN

    I would support it being lifted

    +1

  8. #8
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    As the person who Posted the Report, I agree that an all out MP ban may have been a bit much and that a warning would have been fine for you.
    Kennard Davis
    -Captain
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    -Retired from the Game, just a Forum Lurker now

  9. #9
    Senior Member VortexGaming's Avatar
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    I'd be up for lifting the Mp, and CMP ban. IMO you should of gotten a warning instead of a ban. +1
    Kaitlynn Lawson The Captain: https://cm-ss13.com/old/viewtopic.php?f=142&t=18802
    Alicia The Motherly Synthetic: https://cm-ss13.com/viewtopic.php?f=149&t=17406
    Ja'akir Aki The Messenger of the Gods: //showthrea...or-Application
    Staff history:
    Spoiler Spoiler:

  10. #10
    Dev Team Frans_Feiffer's Avatar
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    I'd be fine with at the least a removal of your Jban from MP, maybe not CMP. I like Heinz' approach to the matter.

    That said though, take this with a grain of salt, however I feel the reason both of you were Jbanned, regardless of notes was that it would appear unjust/unfair so to speak had Rex been Jbanned but you only issued a warning. You both were just as guilty. Yes, your last MP related note was from a year ago. But normal players can't see notes. So while we may bring that point up, and in post we may remove the Jban because of it, I would just like to point that out in relation to the report and the reasoning as to why you were Jbanned as well, as to a normal player that would look a little fishy I would imagine.

    I could be entirely wrong. It's just my view on the situation. As for this appeal though, a little early, but your last MP note was infact a very long time ago, not to mention there is effort in your appeal. You have my +1 for removal of the MP Jban, it's up to the heads to decide if the CMP Jban should be removed as well.

    Your 'Friendly' Neighborhood Captain, Frans Feiffer. Austrian Kommodore vith zie vorst accent, survivor of Space Vietnam, and Loving Caretaker of the Ungas Aboard the USS Almayer.
    Pred App that is now null lol
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    Spoiler Spoiler:

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