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Thread: Current Feature Discussion - Xeno acid damage has no long-term reprecussions

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    Current Feature Discussion - Xeno acid damage has no long-term reprecussions

    Current Feature Discussion
    Main Topic of Discussion
    Xeno acid damage has no long-term reprecussions
    Feature(s) in Question
    Brute damage done by xenos results in fractures, dismemberment, and general unpleasantness that stays with the marine much longer than the revive and normal medic treatment. This tends to annoy marines and make them a bit more wary about just face firsting into xenos, relying on a revive from the wave behind them.
    As a boiler main, I watch marines just stand in Trapper acid because it's relatively mild damage per shot, and they know they can be healed without suffering any fractures/organ damage.
    Opinion of this feature
    I think that the lasting injuries from Brute damage add to the RP/realism factor of, you know, not trying to go toe to toe with a 10 foot xeno with a knife/other stupid stuff, because fracs kinda suck (I'm a medic main in my off-xeno time). As a medic, I've stood behind people at the cades and just healed through trapper damage. I tend to dislike burn victims because there's a lack of complexity in dealing with their injuries as well. Aside from maintaining proper Kelo/KD/burn kits, there is no challenge to dealing with them. I'll take an IB chest/head frac case with possible organ damage and blood loss any damn day.
    As a trapper, it's kinda frustrating that my shotgun is my only REAL punishment for someone wanting to tank my damage. Even with a point blank shotgun, the person walks away with 95 damage to be healed and come back. Just kind of annoying.
    (Optional) Ways to improve this feature
    Implement some kind of semi-permanent damage associated with burn damage. Maybe some kind of counter, where for every 3-400 overall burn damage one has received, a random frac occurs. This would make Marines a bit more aware and respectful of burn damage (and slightly ratchet it up from just an inconvenience). It'd make medics a bit happier, doctors groundside would be a bit less bored, marines would feel a bit more of that 'oh shit' sensation when they realise they're standing in acid, and boilers would feel less and less like borderline-useless unless part of a push that permanently holds ground (Yes, I'm aware base boiler is about controlling ground, and trapper is about taking down cades and forcing marines to act, but doesn't change the fact there are literally no permanent reprecussions to standing in boiler acid aside from draining your medics of supplies.)

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    Discord Manager MrDadMan's Avatar
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    On paper, acid damage doing things like melting a limb off or causing organ damage sounds like a great thing, but in practice, it would likely receive a lot of backlash
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    Senior Member Usnpeepoo's Avatar
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    Burn damage is a joke. Especially with the surgical line, there’s nothing special about it. It’s also the easiest damage to accumulate against xenos, think of ranged castes that deal it. Slashes have all of its effects because of the higher risk (melee) while burn damage is by far a lot less harder to deal damage with. I don’t think making it do permanent damage would be a good idea because of this. However I do think that giving burn damage extra effects (something like working in tandem with brute to delimb more, etc.) would be better.

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    Any of it man. At this point I sat through a 3 hour round as a boiler killing the same people over and over. The meta is currently rushing front with M2C, dropping it, tanking burn damage AND shotguns from boilers, dying, being revived, repeating. As long as they're at the front of a push, they dont lose their M2cs and get pretty quick revives, and they do too much damage for melees to apply any permanent injuries.
    Seriously, let burn damage frac, or suffocate, or have an increasing amount of damage that can't be healed (minor, but extant, like the oxy heart damage from revive).
    Anything at all beyond 'spend 30 seconds synthgrafting and good as new'. Please.
    I legit love playing this game, and love xeno, but with this new M2C cancer and the abuse of no permanent reprecussions for just tanking the best m2c counter, xeno sucks and it's made medic kinda cringey to play for me as well. Taking a break for a bit till something changes, like most other xeno mains have been.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrDadMan View Post
    On paper, acid damage doing things like melting a limb off or causing organ damage sounds like a great thing, but in practice, it would likely receive a lot of backlash
    Both boiler specs can be avoided with situational awareness, and other xeno castes that use acid that are a bit harder to avoid would just force the marine to go to a doctor at some point from the front lines, basically in the same way that a frontline marine accumulates fracs and organ issues from brute attacks. Honestly you could implement the same exact mechanics that brute damage causes, but to a much lesser degree, and it'd accomplish this. I'm not asking for hands to melt off or organs to be damaged each time someone gets hit by a spitter or a boiler, but I'm saying that if, as a marine, you get hit by 8 spitter acids in a minute, or 6 boiler mines in a minute... you kinda deserve to have a frac or something.
    Make it an incredibly small chance to happen, and it'd serve the purpose. Literally anything's better than the way it is currently though. I just spent 3 hours fighting, and killing, the same M2c users over and over because at this point they just tank it, die, revive, and come back. Melees can't get close enough to inflict permanent injuries, so I'm literally, as a boiler, hoping to kill them enough to proc a heartbreak (which is what, like 15 revives has a chance?) or hoping that the medics run out of burn supplies, because that's the only point at which I'll see results from the damage I put out (my direct damage, not including my area denial's results, ect). Just kinda disheartening to play and I'm guessing that's why you dont see that many boilers nowadays.

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    Member Castor23's Avatar
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    The way I see it, burn damage from xenos has the advantages of :

    • Being dealt at range (mostly).
    • Dealing more pain than brute damage, ergo "weakening" the target for melee castes to move in.
    • Having side effects to it, i.e. : the base praetorian acid stacks; the spitter DoT & knockdown; DoT for acid runner; warden spit giving internal reserves & acid flood knocking anyone in its way down; boiler gas acting as a smoke screen.


    And probably more that I just won't bother listing right now.
    With all this being said, I believe acid damage is fine as it is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Castor23 View Post
    The way I see it, burn damage from xenos has the advantages of :

    • Being dealt at range (mostly).
    • Dealing more pain than brute damage, ergo "weakening" the target for melee castes to move in.
    • Having side effects to it, i.e. : the base praetorian acid stacks; the spitter DoT & knockdown; DoT for acid runner; warden spit giving internal reserves & acid flood knocking anyone in its way down; boiler gas acting as a smoke screen.


    And probably more that I just won't bother listing right now.
    With all this being said, I believe acid damage is fine as it is.

    This is all mostly outhealed, especially now that most specs/SGs deploy with kelo in their kits and in their systems constantly.
    It takes quite a bit of acid to add pain to the degree where it affects anything. And all of this is remedied in a quarter of a second by a medic with oxy, which they have in stupid quantity.

    You could make the same 'side effects' claim for melee/brute damage. It does weaken them. The fact is that acid is stupid weak, burn damage is simple to fix and it's to the point that as a medic I dont even bother checking specs/sgs after they take burn damage, because the VAST majority of the time they're already running around with kelo/tram 24/7 and it's just annoying to check someone, chase them down, and then have nothing to do. I doubt it was intended, or if intended that it's fair, that every significant cornerstone of the marine force is able to 100% counteract any xeno ranged from the start. Fracs fix this, at least until marines get a portable frac fixer of some kind.

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    Member Castor23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calvindoyl View Post
    This is all mostly outhealed, especially now that most specs/SGs deploy with kelo in their kits and in their systems constantly.
    It takes quite a bit of acid to add pain to the degree where it affects anything. And all of this is remedied in a quarter of a second by a medic with oxy, which they have in stupid quantity.

    You could make the same 'side effects' claim for melee/brute damage. It does weaken them. The fact is that acid is stupid weak, burn damage is simple to fix and it's to the point that as a medic I dont even bother checking specs/sgs after they take burn damage, because the VAST majority of the time they're already running around with kelo/tram 24/7 and it's just annoying to check someone, chase them down, and then have nothing to do. I doubt it was intended, or if intended that it's fair, that every significant cornerstone of the marine force is able to 100% counteract any xeno ranged from the start. Fracs fix this, at least until marines get a portable frac fixer of some kind.
    No, it's not mostly outhealed. Please test in local or check the code.

    Furthermore, it does not take "quite a bit of acid to add pain to the degree it affects anything". Two spits from a base praetorian will cause enough pain to slow a marine down, while with tramadol, it will take around 4 (50-60 burn damage on the analyzer).

    The argument you present about it having the same "side effects" does not make sense, as I meant other mechanics go hand in hand with the acid damage itself.

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    Burn damage used to be fine, but stopped being relevant the moment devs decided to circumvent defib heartbreak mechanic that was intended to stop freebie revives by adding surgical line. Remove that shit or at least make it not work on the dead.

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    Surgical/Synth lines were the worst additions to medical in a very long time. Its a testament to the dev cycle that the OG surgical line survived for nearly 6 months, and that its successors are still in the game. It should get removed, increase kit effectiveness if worried about the ability to heal people, and while at it make it so you can't infinitely restock them from venders.
    Synth Gaming

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