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Thread: taketheshot56 - Rule #3 and Rule #4

  1. #1
    Junior Member NewOriginalSchwann's Avatar
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    taketheshot56 - Rule #3 and Rule #4

    Player Report
    Your Byond ID?
    NewOriginalSchwann

    Your Character Name?
    Yin, Synthetic

    Accused Byond Key(if known):
    taketheshot56

    Accused Character Name
    Patton Moore, Commodore

    Approximate time and date of the incident (Central US Time for fastest results)
    From roughly 9:00PM to 10:45PM CST

    What rule(s) were broken:
    Rule #3 and Rule #4

    Description of the incident:
    I joined as the round start synthetic and started my duties as usual - shoving all my equipment on in a blind panic in order to get to requisitions as quickly as possible before an attachment riot broke out. Before heading to requisitions the Commodore, Patton Moore, requested that I scout with the vessel's intelligence officers when I ducked into the CIC to check the crew manifest. If memory serves me correctly he stated I was the "intelligence robit [sic] (Moore repeatedly referred to me as "robit" or "tin can" throughout the round)," for the operation. I stated that I was first needed at requisitions, which had one person (a cargo technician) working it, and sprinted off to man the north line.

    In the middle of the requisitions rush, perhaps 12:15-12:20 into the operation, Commodore Moore again stated that I was to accompany the intelligence officers to the surface and scout for intelligence. Recalling discussions I had had with fellow synthetic players I refused, citing law five. I was then declared faulty. In retrospect, this is where this things began to really fall apart. Following this I was told to report to the CIC after I was finished with requisitions. I did so.

    Upon arriving at the CIC I was repeatedly insulted and belittled (I will never understand why people repeatedly insult essentially emotion-free androids but here we are) and ordered to overwatch a squad. I was initially ordered to overwatch bravo, which had an active Lieutenant, before being ordered to alpha. After a few minutes of observing alpha, I informed the CO that I needed to requisition equipment from my vendor as I had yet to do so in my rush to first complete requisitions, and then return to the CIC to have a man with a Mateba call me a useless piece of scrap. I explicitly stated that I would leave and return shortly. I was gone for one to two minutes at most. Upon my reentry to the CIC Moore insulted me, stated I was essentially deserting my post, and ordered me back. I responded by stating that he was listening poorly. My exact words were as follows:

    "Listening is an excellent trait in leadership, I suggest you prioritize it."

    I did not intend any OOC or IC insult with this, though I understand that it could be interpreted as a slight. In retrospect perhaps I should have phrased it differently, but I was excited to finally offer instructional advice in a round. You know, Yin's quirk? For my actions I was informed that I was being brigged for disrespect of a superior officer for fifteen minutes. My attempts to explain that I had intended no violation were met with orders to lay on the ground. I attempted to be as logical as possible during my arrest, but may have allowed my emotions to seep through. Regardless of my statements I was brigged by the MPs properly after compliantly coming to the brig. At no point during my arrest or detainment did I resist non-verbally.

    I appealed this due to a synthetic's inherent inability to violate marine law, and this appeal was delivered by SSGT Ana Bow. According to her the Commodore was quite rude, which is not surprising to me. Feeling that my ability to perform my duties aboard the ship was hampered even after my release, I sent a complaint form to High Command. The round ended after this, so I unfortunately did not get a response.

    My primary issue with Moore is that his lack of understanding regarding the rules of the synthetic led to this entire incident, and that he was unrelentingly nasty to me for most of the round after my refusal to deploy citing law five.

    Evidence (screenshots, logs, etc):
    Unfortunately I was unable to save any records of my own aside from the statement that provoked all of this (seen above). It is my hope that moderators will be able to provide relevant logs allowing for the swift conclusion of this report.

    How you would punish the accused:
    Education on the synthetic job, its rules, and its programming. A CO, particularly a member of the CO council and a staff member, should know how all personnel under his command function - including the synthetic. Such a lack of understanding is unbecoming of taketheshot56's position. - it would be unbecoming of a regular captain. Ultimately I leave the punishment up to staff.

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    The CO Council and Emerald/Grimcad will eventually get to this, If ANYONE saw this come forward. Otherwise Rule 2.

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    I was playing as LT Aaron Blackburn, and was in CiC during this, at the time I was manning overwatch for both Alpha and Bravo.

    Moore got increasingly aggravated with Yin at her refusal to deploy, and, along with an LT, insulted her and called her defective. Moore finally relented and ordered Yin to man the overwatch console for Bravo. Yin stated that it appeared to already be manned, and Moore told her to man Alpha instead. Moore continued to degrade Yin, and the aforementioned LT was egging him on. I was focused on watching Bravo, so I missed Yin saying she was going to leave, but I poked my head back into the CiC when I saw Moore yelling at her for "abandoning her post", which led to her comment, and Moore having her brigged for being disrespectful, as she was clearly being "Sarcastic". I commented that I wasn't positive if a Synth could be sarcastic(I'm still not sure, honestly), but my comment went unacknowledged. When Yin attempted to explain herself she was labeled "Insubordinate" as well, and the MP batoned her, to very little effect. After that she was dragged off and I went back to manning both posts.

    later I could hear Moore's side of a conversation with what I assume was the MP bringing the appeal Schwann mentioned. It caught my attention because he was vigorously insulting Yin again, saying he wouldn't take that kind of attitude from a "robit", and ended with telling the MP to wear their beret, then announced that everyone was expected to wear their headgear.

    It is also worth noting that while Yin was imprisoned, the Bravo Squad SL, SSGT Balto "Crunk" Dreg(I apologize if I got your nickname and last name flipped), was requesting additional medical support, and requested Yin by name. The CDRE simply stated that she was in custody.

    I honestly feel that Moore's treatment of Yin was largely due to his frustration at her refusing to deploy on an intel gathering mission. Between his verbal abuse of her, taking the slightest excuse to have her arrested, and attempting to tell her that she was interpreting her core rules, specifically rule 5, if I'm remembering what she cited correctly.

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    Senior Member SolubleWhenWet's Avatar
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    For Staff and Council reference, this report and //showthrea...list-Violation are linked occurrences.

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    As a character witness (me being XO that round and present for many of the incidents that occured), I can confirm that Yin constantly refused to follow Patton's orders, leading him to refer to her as a defective robit (obviously just accent thing). I think the logs will help since I was on overwatch for Charlie the entire time and didn't catch all of the exchanges between the two, but it definetely came off like Yin was purposefully acting against the CO and was even responding with emotional sarcasm. It also doesn't help that later on in the round, Yin blatantly overruled command during Delta alert and ordered marines to the pods, even though I (the acting Commanding Officer) ordered SD to be announced.

    0a18be87f0fdf3e60146e53e138d6e6b.jpg

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    From your report on Schwann, Viperious:

    "Once we all boarded and the Normandy launched, I immediately announced over Command comms that the CiC staff were to initiate evacuation, Distress and SD."

    Meaning that no, Yin did not countermand your orders to call for evac. YOU ordered evac, she just made the announcement. Most likely because I was sitting at the console struggling to navigate the menu because I'd never done it before, and was taking too long.

    Not to mention, Yin never "purposefully acted against the CO" because as mentioned, his initial orders were directly violating the Synth's core programing.

  7. #7
    Admin solidfury7's Avatar
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    Hey chaps.

    I was SSGT William Crimson, MP. I was also called to the Captains Office, along side the CMP upon the request of the Captain. Upon arriving, the Captain informed us of his issues with the synthetic and asked us for advice.

    After a brief chat, the three of us came to the conclusion that the comments described by the Captain could be seen as disrespect to a superior, as synthetics are treated as humans within marine law and thus it applies to them. Upon going to make the arrest, the synthetic was somewhat argumentative and acted with limited resistance, only eventually submitting to an arrest after I threatened to use non-lethal force to detain them, they did eventually comply. During the arrest, there were plenty of comments between myself and the synthetic which could raise eyebrow of a faulty synthetic, however this could also be put down to a quirk.

    Considering that the synthetic which was acting as an SO, made a comment which an SO likely would have been detained for, I am not terribly surprised that this arrest happened. Undermining the Captain, intentionally or otherwise is always going to cause the neck-hairs of Captains to prickle within roleplay and it would be punished accordingly.

    I am slightly confused about the direction of the conversation in this report, people are citing "Synths cannot break marine law" in the same way people go "MPs cannot break marine law" and they are using this as an argument. I do not believe this holds any merit, sometimes situations occur which may tow the line and may be percieved as breaches of marine law, however they are too minor or make sense within roleplay to merit any intervention from the Council OR the staff.

    I believe this is one of them, while your comment may not have been intended to be offencive or malicious, it was taken in such a way. These are two of the most High RP roles so It is not a surprising turn of events. If the staff wish to prevent situations like this in the future, it'd either result in more restrictions on synthetic behaviour, a reworking in marine law or further clarification on rulings and behaviours.

    I don't think anyone wants more restrictions when it comes to roleplay, but that is just my two cents on the situation I was in.

  8. #8
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    Ana Bow here, can confirm what she said about the constant insulting, ordering yin to be brigged, and misunderstanding of synthetic law, while I personally was unaware of the programming law that forbid them from deploying to help intel, Captain Moore had been a bit of a cunt, as well as the rest of the CIC crew, for some reason. I did handle the interrogation in the cell, and handed a transcript of it to the captain (had I known there would be a player report I'd have saved a picture of it), I've had repeated incidents with Moore over petty shittery before, and while I don't know how much it reflects on take the shot OOCly, I've heard almost universal scorn for them as a captain OOCly, for one reason or another, and while that's irrelevant to the matter at hand, I can admit I could have been more neutral in dealing with the situation, as my experiences ICly and OOCly with Captain Moore has made me dread ever seeing them in that role, and might have biased me against them in my investigation. Which is why I'm glad I didnt have to make any arrests personally, and everything I brought up to captain was in Yin's own words so that wasn't an issue!


    If there are any other question you have for me on the issue, ping me on discord kooarbiter #2360

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    Howdy, I was playing the LT Billy Williams this round and was a direct witness to the events that transpired here (in fact, I must confess I was one of the people making derogatory comments towards the synth). I don't necessarily think Moore/taketheshot56 was out of line by brigging Yin, nor do I think Yin was guilty of any wrongdoing with his sarcastic passive-aggressiveness. In all, the situation seemed like a breakdown of communications from both an IC and an OOC perspective.

    ICly, Yin rejected the orders because they were against his "directives" which is perfectly reasonable, as was Moore's threat to have him checked out for malfunctions upon reaching port. Now, I can't speak for Moore, but in my experience as CO, when I call a synth malfunctioning, it's when I tacitly accept a synth can't carry out orders OOCly but I'm annoyed about it ICly. From a character perspective, if the CO knew every nuance of synth programming, they'd probably be an IT guy or engineer, not a line officer.

    It was at this point things started escalating. Yin moved away from his overwatch a moment later, which got him yelled at (although any organic LT would also get yelled at for leaving their post, so I fail to see how this is indicative of a plot by Moore to goad Yin into breaking marine law) for leaving his post. Several minutes later, Yin made his backhanded comment "Effective leadership is grounded on being a good listener" which caused his arrest. In the moment, it seemed pretty catty and the kind of thing a novice XO would say when trying to bait a BE from their CO but I digress; technically it was a factual statement- listening is important so he wasn't wrong, just poor in his timing.

    In all, this entire encounter seems like the kind of scene that would play out between synthetics and humans, where human emotions misinterpret a machine's objective and cold attempt at help as sarcasm and snarkiness. I also don't think Moore was unjustified in reacting as he did, I think we've all wanted to throw our computer out a window at one point or another for updating at the wrong time or deleting an important file. And for what it's worth, I think had an organic SO done the same thing, they would have faced similar consequences if not worse.

  10. #10
    CM-SS13 Host ThesoldierLLJK's Avatar
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    Ok here's the logs from that round

    Yin chat
    Spoiler Spoiler:


    Patton's logs
    Spoiler Spoiler:

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