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Thread: Ahana - Mutiny. Roleplay Expectations

  1. #21
    Senior Member Dreven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warfan1815 View Post
    Alright it seems like I have finally fixed some issues with my computer, and I can get on with this.
    __________________________________________________ __________________________

    First some addendums (requested by Ahana) that I think I have reason to believe are true:

    Spoiler Spoiler:
    X6

    Now onto ahelps,

    Spoiler Spoiler:
    Even if Ahana didn't plan for me to get OD'd, she did plan an illegal mutiny that wasn't ahelped and also had less than 5 people. Also a deployed Commander does not give up command of the operation, you can do so, but just because your in CIC does *not* mean you cannot be in charge of the marine force. Ontop of all that, requesting that the CO return to ship because you "arent comfortable in your position" seems like your going to cryo. If they wanted me to return to CIC to help them in CIC then that would be valid, but it is NOT a valid a reason to demand a CO to return shipside because you want to go AWOL and do an illegal mutiny.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreven View Post
    Even if Ahana didn't plan for me to get OD'd, she did plan an illegal mutiny that wasn't ahelped and also had less than 5 people. Also a deployed Commander does not give up command of the operation, you can do so, but just because your in CIC does *not* mean you cannot be in charge of the marine force. Ontop of all that, requesting that the CO return to ship because you "arent comfortable in your position" seems like your going to cryo. If they wanted me to return to CIC to help them in CIC then that would be valid, but it is NOT a valid a reason to demand a CO to return shipside because you want to go AWOL and do an illegal mutiny.
    I'm pretty sure all mutinies are illegal. They're actually punishable by death for high treason, labeled as sedition in marine law.

    I followed all your orders up until the boiling point. Even when you returned shipside, I was following your orders. Only when the heads of staff aboard the vessel at the time unanimously agreed (aside from the CMP, of course) that a mutiny was in our best interests, did my eyes ever stop being glued to overwatch and TacMaps. I spent about over an hour performing the duties expected of a XO, so less than a five minute break away from a tension-filled area to RP shouldn’t have been out of line with the active CO in CIC.

    As a consequence of this, I briefly left CIC. Being gone for a little over a minute - you announced the following:
    [01:25:20]ANNOUNCEMENT: Drevenshekel/(Wamakahana Windhealer) has announced the following: I believe the XO and other disloyal CIC personnel are plotting against me on the ship. I need 5 loyal marines to report back to the Almayer as additional security
    As I mentioned earlier, mutinies are punishable by death. The CO has the ability to summarily execute anyone they deem a threat to themselves or the operation. I do not believe it would have been in our (especially my) favor to discuss mutineering you in your face - unless perhaps that's what you're going at.

    Essentially, this forced my hand to actively organize the mutiny, so that my character would survive. You need 5 people prior to ahelping to request a mutiny (and to see if it is valid), and logs prove this to be my intent as to not breach the server rules.
    [01:23:54]SAY: Eleanor Tudor [1]: CMO. (CKEY: Ahana) (JOB: Executive Officer)
    [01:24:07]SAY: Eleanor Tudor [1]: You are alongside us? (CKEY: Ahana) (JOB: Executive Officer)
    [01:24:17]SAY: Eleanor Tudor [1]: Can you rally your department? (CKEY: Ahana) (JOB: Executive Officer)
    [01:27:56]SAY: Eleanor Tudor [MedSci]: CMO. (CKEY: Ahana) (JOB: Executive Officer)
    [01:28:09]SAY: Eleanor Tudor [MedSci]: Proceed with the plan. (CKEY: Ahana) (JOB: Executive Officer)
    Unfortunately, my character would rather not be executed on the spot by returning to CIC, and as such, ran inside of maintenance awaiting the heads of staff to gather their departments and prepare a mutiny.

    The reasoning behind our want to mutiny was that you were severely hindering CIC - refusing to budge on so much as letting CIC order around a single marine or fireteam without going through you. This led to heavy casualties and a faltering front (that managed to prevail in the end, however was devastating to see from CIC). You had an entire shipside crew that wanted to interact and partake in the round. You favorited those that deployed on the ground with or without permission instead of your crew - even retroactively deploying CIC personnel when you could obviously see I was upset over it. You were also rendering CIC effectively useless with minimal future communication of plans to us. We had asked a plethora of times for at least the most minimal autonomy - which was denied and we were struggling to see the future plan, as you failed to even communicate with CIC on various occasions and ignored us/our requests. As CO, you failed to lead holistically. If you so desperately want to run the operation with an iron fist, don’t drag CIC through the mud without you being in it and proceed to harass/bully your second in command over it.

    Also, for your death - I have quite literally zero idea of why the CMO killed you. I was trying to get them to rally their department. I never ordered your death, so their investigation is completely separate from the report against me.

    Let me know if there’s any questions.

  3. #23
    Senior Member Dreven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimson View Post
    I'm pretty sure all mutinies are illegal. They're actually punishable by death for high treason, labeled as sedition in marine law.

    I followed all your orders up until the boiling point. Even when you returned shipside, I was following your orders. Only when the heads of staff aboard the vessel at the time unanimously agreed (aside from the CMP, of course) that a mutiny was in our best interests, did my eyes ever stop being glued to overwatch and TacMaps. I spent about over an hour performing the duties expected of a XO, so less than a five minute break away from a tension-filled area to RP shouldn’t have been out of line with the active CO in CIC.

    As a consequence of this, I briefly left CIC. Being gone for a little over a minute - you announced the following:


    As I mentioned earlier, mutinies are punishable by death. The CO has the ability to summarily execute anyone they deem a threat to themselves or the operation. I do not believe it would have been in our (especially my) favor to discuss mutineering you in your face - unless perhaps that's what you're going at.

    Essentially, this forced my hand to actively organize the mutiny, so that my character would survive. You need 5 people prior to ahelping to request a mutiny (and to see if it is valid), and logs prove this to be my intent as to not breach the server rules.


    Unfortunately, my character would rather not be executed on the spot by returning to CIC, and as such, ran inside of maintenance awaiting the heads of staff to gather their departments and prepare a mutiny.

    The reasoning behind our want to mutiny was that you were severely hindering CIC - refusing to budge on so much as letting CIC order around a single marine or fireteam without going through you. This led to heavy casualties and a faltering front (that managed to prevail in the end, however was devastating to see from CIC). You had an entire shipside crew that wanted to interact and partake in the round. You favorited those that deployed on the ground with or without permission instead of your crew - even retroactively deploying CIC personnel when you could obviously see I was upset over it. You were also rendering CIC effectively useless with minimal future communication of plans to us. We had asked a plethora of times for at least the most minimal autonomy - which was denied and we were struggling to see the future plan, as you failed to even communicate with CIC on various occasions and ignored us/our requests. As CO, you failed to lead holistically. If you so desperately want to run the operation with an iron fist, don’t drag CIC through the mud without you being in it and proceed to harass/bully your second in command over it.

    Also, for your death - I have quite literally zero idea of why the CMO killed you. I was trying to get them to rally their department. I never ordered your death, so their investigation is completely separate from the report against me.

    Let me know if there’s any questions.

    As I've said before, your job as XO was to manage shipside departments and provide tactical assistance to myself on the ground, you could barely do that (being extremely late to load the OB, filling comms with so much complaining it was making the SL's angry). It has never been a rule that a deployed CO must relinquish operational command to the XO, you are not the whitelisted CO, I do not know why you would expect to have "ownership" over a squad or fireteam or anything, thats not how that works. The mutiny was OOC illegal and a major rule breach, the XO is the 2nd highest ranking officer aboard the ship and must have a VERY GOOD reason to break orders and organise a mutiny, "wah wah windhealer didn't let me be CO" is not a good reason at all, you had your job to do that was befitting of your station. I communicated with CIC as much as possible, even went to the effort of drawing up a plan on paint, then told you what we were doing throughout the operation, I am the CO however and its my responsibility and right to make calls for the marines, not yours, get the WL if you want to run things your way. Anyway were going in circles now, let staff resolve this out.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Dreven's Avatar
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    bump?

  5. #25
    CM-SS13 Vice Host
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    Sorry for the delay, this will be resolved no later than week today. (26th Jan Latest)
    Charles & Arthur Edwinson
    Synth Percival | Artyom
    Yautja Kjhute Luar-ke

    Record:
    Spoiler Spoiler:



    Discord: forest2001#2001

  6. #26
    Mod Manager ScarletReign's Avatar
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    Hi there! The CO Council is responsible for reviewing if CO conduct is or is not appropriate, as they have already investigated and reached a conclusion, I will be focusing on the issue of the unauthorized mutiny.

    The logs show the XO planning the mutiny with the RO and telling the CMO to proceed with with execution. While this did not follow the typical format of a mutiny on CM, the logs show that:
    - The XO spoke to and conspired with others to mutiny.
    - The XO gave the CMO the go ahead to proceed with the execution.
    - There was some RP around the mutiny, but authorization was neither requested or granted.

    On CM, a mutiny requires two conditions to be met to be considered within the rules, the first is there must be a valid RP reason, and the second is authorization from staff. Authorization should always be considered denied unless explicitly granted, so for instance, if someone ahelps for permission and the ahelp is not answered, it should be considered denied for the purpose of server rules. Taking into account note history, this will result in a heavy warning (Rule 11, ML- Mutinies) and a warning (Rule 2, Roleplay-Sanity). While I understand it can be deeply frustrating to be ordered to do something you don't want to do, or that doesn't match what you had hoped to do in the round, the XO was provided with several acceptable options for ways they could contribute to the operation, and after a great deal of thought, I feel that planning an execution in this circumstance pushes the limits of what would be considered a reasonable response. (As a side note, I did see that the XO expressed concerns that the CO would have them arrested upon returning to the Almayer, but attempting to evade charges or arrest is not considered a valid reason for killing someone per our server rules.)

    Based on note history and standard escalation, this will be a 24 ban.

    Additionally, as the mutiny was not authorized, the CMO will be given a heavy warning for Improper Escalation.

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