Hellbarbs(?) - BE usage and baiting mutiny.

[Banned User ID63]

Those logs miss the part where the LT tried to get him to stop, with grabs or disarms - he did say stop interfering, or some such.

[Swagile]

The presence of the CO has to be respected and understood as the figure in charge. Doing something like what you people did, you should�ve taken it into consideration that you had high chances of getting BEd on the spot.

I don�t see anything wrong in BEing a marine that is threatening and assaulting your MP while disrespecting the CO. I would�ve done it as well.

If the CMP who is supposed to be the figure of discipline in the ship is disrespecting and assaulting an officer of a superior rank without a marine law charge or warrant, I would BE them as well.

I see nothing wrong with the BEs here and it doesn�t look like anything to bait a mutiny. Its simply the rock bottom of establishing order when things fall out of line. Baiting a mutiny would be directed to the entirety of the marine force, leading them astray, purpusefully denying them equipment and assets that would otherwise be of important use.

And yes, you can BE a guy for interfering with an arrest causing unrest and fallingnout of line under your direct orders and presence. It is within your right to do so and a shortcut to the BS. The BE does not make much sense in a realistic scenario, because it was introduce as an IC way to deal with these kind of issues. Take responsibility for your actions and think in advance.

BE is used as a shortcut in a battle field or high intensity situation where someone is directly undermining your command in a time when you actually need that command.

An example being Bravo SL is directly disobeying to move his squad to Civ Residences in Prison Station when you need that squad to save Alpha squad, and this direct disobedience leads to the wipe of Alpha squad (or can lead to a wipe).

BE wasn't meant so that you can BE someone who ignores your order to stop disarming a MP; you slap them in the face with a telebaton or let the MP deal with it (as it is their job).

If we were allowed to BE simply for someone ignoring our orders in a non-combat situation, we'd have a lot more retarded BE's. Especially when MP's are there to do their job and arrest the culprit. Hence why I believe the BE of a marine disarming a MP (which can be dealt with by said MP) is way over the top. If you REALLY wanted to punish him, you could have either asked MP's to give him the largest sentence, or even telebatoned him on a non-vital limb to give him a few fractures as punishment for being a dickhead. Perma killing him out of the round for something as little as that? That isn't what we're given BE rights for.

As for the baiting for a mutiny, we only got ONE good command announcement about our orders, told to drop LZ-2 (half of the squads) with no Comms, then after one or two meme announcements finally given direction while we were being decked on by xeno's and the queen screech.

Command is there to give direction while understanding the general flow of the game, and directing it as such. There are things out of your hands that can't be blamed (bad Engineers, SL's, etc.) but there ARE things Command controls that is SOLELY their fault if they fuck up (Command announcements, supplies, OB's). Command fucked up with Command Announcements; instead of using it for its proper usage, to ensure marines know whats up and to direct them in times of stress, it was used to send meme announcements with very little to no real information or orders.

Now, the argument is that since it was a XO that did it, your not at fault (you even send me a meme on discord about it). You, as CPT, knew this was happening and even rewarded the XO with a meme medal on top of this all, so despite knowing someone under your direct command was being incompetent, you let them keep doing so.

Yet you have no problem BEing someone for disarming a MP that could deal with it via their stun weaponry.

Hence the "baiting mutiny" part of the report.

[Arbs]

Look, you don't really need to explain me all of these things. I can link you my CO app if you want to read more.

I totally agree with your first statement though. I also explained it already that the BE was introduced for exactly senseless situations (disarming an MP in front of a CO) that require senseless solutions (getting BEd for it). I don't mind making extensive use of the MPs, but if someone does something like that to under your presence as a CO, on your face, undermining your orders and all that, they are going to get the Mateba. That's the part I wanted to clear up. I can send you some past player reports under me as a CO to demonstrate.

Though I see a misconception about BEs and mutinies. BEs are not a mutiny express kind of thing as popular belief may be, except for cases of going overboard or if it's on some figure that the marines praise, however a mutiny can be triggered by different factors, coming from squad leaders usually, or general discontent with incompetentce (in case of bald XOs) or plain vile orders that are given (usually over things like denying necessary supplies or simply sending your marines to die).

Even then, not doing a good job at commanding does not make BEs any less of a possibility to be used. I understand that it may cause discontent to you or some sensitive others, but I don't see any correlation between these BEs and baiting a mutiny. And from what I see, even if some announcements were deemed rather bad, which is something I would not do, tactical instructions were delivered anyhow.

And as long as the CO is satisfied with any personnel really, a medal would be provided. At least the XO did their job, unlike that marine who was assaulting an MP in front of the CO even after being told to not to and stop.

Perhaps the announcements were sadly un-enjoyable for you, but it definitely doesn't look like baiting a mutiny.

[Bancrose]

The Council will post on this shortly.

[Banned User ID63]

has it been shortly yet

[Emerald Blood]

It has been shortly. The BE's themselves are nothing over the line and are within the rules. Even disarm spam, you're basically trying to wrestle the guy to the ground and even if you're not actually going lethal on the guy, that's still an aggressive motion and isn't just a passive action to do whenever. The CMP interaction is also nothing extreme for the CO to BE over as well. I will say to Sleepy and all CO that while BE's like these are allowed, avoid making this a common event as a large number of reports regarding BE's for any CO can result in possible suspension or removal of CO due to the role still being there to enhance the round, not constantly BE people. Other than that statement/warning, no other actions are needed. Resolved.