Marine gameplay feeling stale and unrewarding

[LuckyX1]

Command APC could be just replaced with Recon/JTAC variant:
- Stick in long ranged flare launcher (maybe even cluster variant) for both normal and signal. Alternatively, add oversized light source to burn peoples eyes on top of APC roof.
- Add JTAC function to call in CAS/OB and get coordinates for command. Maybe even giving bonuses to CAS?
- If still underpowered, add unnmanned LMG (IFF friendily) or even short ranged radar for command to track xenos above CIC.

It wouldn't be powerhouse in combat like tank, but it would at least serve purpose of force multiplier for marines without disrupting marines on front. Armor Core is supposed to work around Infantry, not other way around imho.

[DefinitelyAlone0309]

Armor Core is supposed to work around Infantry, not the other way around imho.

So much this.

[mandalore66]

Huge parts that only few players enjoy. Mainly two VC. No one else.

Wow, sounds just like queen, XO and MP!

Just a useless role only 1-2 guys enjoy...

[CABAL]

Wow, sounds just like queen, XO and MP!

Just a useless role only 1-2 guys enjoy...

You don't get what I have in mind. Both marines and benos don't like gameplay that tank provides. Only VCs like that, which is usually only two players each round.
I can imagine that many benos enjoy Queen, they like what gameplay she provides for certain.
Both marines and benos don't mind XO, because he provides basically 0 input to the game from CIC and planetside he is just SL+.
Xenos most certainly enjoy MPs existance, since they arrest medics, engineers and robust PFCs, thus they make beno work easier.

XO and MPs have rarerly bigger impact to the round than single PFC has.

In comparsion, despite that there is only one SADAR each round, marines enjoy that spec, because its the only thing T3's fear (outside LTB tank). You don't have to babysit spec, you don't have to create FOBs with him in mind, you don't have to shoot walls so he can go trough etc.

[mandalore66]

You don't get what I have in mind. Both marines and benos don't like gameplay that tank provides. Only VCs like that, which is usually only two players each round.
I can imagine that many benos enjoy Queen, they like what gameplay she provides for certain.
Both marines and benos don't mind XO, because he provides basically 0 input to the game from CIC and planetside he is just SL+.
Xenos most certainly enjoy MPs existance, since they arrest medics, engineers and robust PFCs, thus they make beno work easier.

XO and MPs have rarerly bigger impact to the round than single PFC has.

In comparsion, despite that there is only one SADAR each round, marines enjoy that spec, because its the only thing T3's fear (outside LTB tank). You don't have to babysit spec, you don't have to create FOBs with him in mind, you don't have to shoot walls so he can go trough etc.

I like seeing the tank even when I'm not a TC. Ss13 is about simulation. Not everything has to be enjoyable for everyone at all times.

this design philosophy, that everything should be enjoyable for everyone at all times is for is for theme park games. Last I checked ss13 is not one of them...

[CABAL]

I like seeing the tank even when I'm not a TC. Ss13 is about simulation. Not everything has to be enjoyable for everyone at all times.

this design philosophy, that everything should be enjoyable for everyone at all times is for is for theme park games. Last I checked ss13 is not one of them...

Pure SS13 maybe is, but certainly not CM. While not everything can be enjoyable for everyone, things that are universally hated, because they give too much power into hands of few players who win the lottery of roundstart pick.

And I do think that design philosophy for any game that isn't some kind of retarded social experiment, to be as much enjoyable as possible. Especially multiplayer games. We might as well get overall very low sounds, but then, certain things like shoots to be played 100% volume and flash the player with bright lights causing severe headache and even attacks of epilepsy. After all, not everything should be enjoyable for everyone at all times. It's for theme park games.

[mandalore66]

. We might as well get overall very low sounds, but then, certain things like shoots to be played 100% volume and flash the player with bright lights causing severe headache and even attacks of epilepsy. After all, not everything should be enjoyable for everyone at all times. It's for theme park games.

I thought we were having a serious discussion... apparently not...

[CABAL]

I thought we were having a serious discussion... apparently not...

It is serious. Tank is simply bad. Its removal would benefit everyone outside only few hard-on VC mains. Its not like with nerfs for something on one side, or buffs for something on the other, where bias and overall whiny atitude might not be the best course advice. Tank is universally hated, its objectively the single strongest marine asset and its all in hands of two players each round.
Synth, Pred and CO are whitelisted (among other things) to sort people who server can trust with additional power, because they might have big impact on the game. As previously mentioned, those two VC in tank contribute more to the fight than 4 Preds, 2 Synths and CO combined. Just because such powerfull weapon exist, benos have to be balanced around both marines and tank, but things that work against tank will also work just as good against marines and groups of them.

In short: I think that PFC's (as a core of CM players) should have more power at the cost of removing tank. As simple as that. Again, its not discussion about nerfing certain things, its not discussion about buffing certain things, its discussion about removing something that is simply not fun for anyone but few.

[Don]

Imagine putting a 3x3 box in a map made of on average 3 tile wide corridors.

That you can't shoot through.

APC is cool because you can interact with it, tank is fun for two people.

[Just L]

Imagine putting a 3x3 box in a map made of on average 3 tile wide corridors.

That you can't shoot through.

APC is cool because you can interact with it, tank is fun for two people.

You can interact with the APC by being annoyed at the crewmen for taking it instead of a tank. It needs substantial buffs, as it is clear that it was designed to be too weak due to the tank's previous absurd strength.