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Thread: My opinion on the problem with predators

  1. #1
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    My opinion on the problem with predators

    I have played cm ss13 off and on for many years now. I'm not particulary robust, in fact I'm pretty bad considering how long I've played. I'm not involved in the server in any way besides logging onto it and playing. I've played both sides and many roles in the past, but for the last year or so I play as squad marine pretty much exclusively. I say all this to establish that my point of view is more or less an "average player." Let me also say that I don't really know much about predators except as I've encountered them in game.

    Today I played for the first time in a few months. I joined as squad marine and made my way to the front lines. On the way there I see a predator push over a marine. I take out my gun, and he pushes me over too. "Fuck it" I thought, and after I got up I just left. I know I can just leave, because the pred isn't going to do anything. I know he isn't going to hurt the other marine, unless the marine hurts him first.

    This is BORING. As a player, I want to care about preds. I really do. But theres just NO REASON to care.

    In any given round, if I hear over the radio that a pred killed someone, my only thought is "well, he fucked with a pred and died, thats what happens. Either he was a new player, or was bored." I continue to fight xeno. I don't think "A cloaked humanoid has killed one of my squad, he is a threat that must be dealt with!" Nope, I know the marine started it because if a pred sneezes too hard on a marine they get banned. This has been the case for as long as I've been playing.

    I know that preds work hard on their back story. I know theres honor duels, elaborite lore, rituals, etc. They are a race of badass warrior spirit killing machines. In lore.

    In gameplay, they are the equivalent to an unfunny, vanilla ss13 clown who is kill baiting. Literally knocking people over in the hopes that someone fights them so they can retaliate with their 37 badass sci fi weapons. I'm sure there are some preds that don't do that. I don't know but I assume they instead stalk around the map barely encountering marines. Thats pretty lame too.

    The solution in my eyes is to nerf preds somewhat, and let them kill people unprovoked. Maybe not kill, just maim. Maybe not always, but only some pred rounds. Maybe not have carte blanche, maybe they just get one or 2 free murders. But please, let them do something. If that were the case, when I get the call over the radio that a pred killed someone, both IC and OOC I would consider it a legitimate threat and something thats going to have actual impact on the round. If that were the case, when I come across a predator fucking with a fellow marine, theres a high chance I pull the trigger instead of pulling out my gun with literally zero OOC intention to fire it.

    Please make predators interesting. Please make me care about them. Right now they're just a tease and a wasted opportunity for cool shit to happen.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Pigeon's Avatar
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    They removed lurker chain pounce becuase it annoyed marines, they nerfed lunge that any resist will get you out becuase it annoyed marines, they remove instant neuro becuase it annoyed marines, they nerfed pain becuase it annoyed marines, they nerfed pain crit itself becuase it annoyed marines, they removed diseases becuase it annoyed marines, they removed delimbs practically (it still possible but the main guy doing it the rav doesn't specialize in it anymore if I remember), and so and so forth.

    Giving any room that a predator can go up and shit on your day will never exist becuase marines hate having to deal with anything beyond get a shotgun maybe some combat stims and rush the aliens. They hate command, they hate MPs, they medical, they hate engineering, they hate anything thats gets in the way of TDM. Predators are a random factor they don't want becuase it hard to kill if it was allowed to have fun, it got to be gimped to be murdered by local robusto for the millionth time.

  3. #3
    Senior Member CABAL's Avatar
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    I don't know from where you get that idea, but pred can fuck you up even if you didn't provoke him. You don't care about them and you never were attacked by one, because they usually are restrained from attacking newbies/random names, because in most of the cases they wouldn't give much a challenging fight.
    Pred in gameplay is more like vanilla SS13 Wizard, than Clown. Wizard that made up some rules for himself and others and searches for those who are "worthy" of a fight. Unless its some baldo pred (and those are not in short supply) that aren't too robust, so they are likely to avoid robust names and kill randoms.
    Just read their "Code of Honor": "https://cm-ss13.com/forums/showthread.php?46-Predator-Honor-Code"
    Where is there written that pred can't do shit if you don't do shit to him? Only in certain situations like being a medic who treats marines, or injured one.



    Imagine bringing up balance changes and beno nerfs to a thread about preds.
    Lurker chain pounce was piss poor easy and bullshit tactic and you have BOO to confirm. Wait... You don't have him to confirm, because he left when this cheap shot one-trick was reworked on Lurker.
    Warrior lunge was just as bullshit.
    Such as one-hit neuro.
    Pain was bullshit also. Imagine getting broken chest, healing it as much as you can without surgery, splinting and still fucking "fumbling with your hands" each 10 fricking seconds. Great gameplay, it was only "annoying", not fucking broken and stupid.
    Pain crit was bullshit on top of that. Not only dropping shit each 10 seconds, but also fucking dropping completly on the ground and suffocating after luckey RNG beno slash.
    Removed diseases, because it annoyed marines? As much as I know, it was removed to reduce lag. If benos aren't annoyed by lags and marines are, then I'm fucking helpless against brain benomainism. This is true disease of our time, fuck those chinese bat soup infections, brain benomainism is true pandemic with subtle symptoms like this.
    Removed delimbs? As far as I know, even fucking heavy armor lost hand and feet protection and permanent damage tresholds weren't raised either.

    You want to party in this way little birdy?
    They removed nest guarding, because it annoyed benos.
    They removed roundstart LTB, because it annoyed benos.
    They removed flaming nade box for instant big explosion, because it annoyed benos.
    They removed "glass shard cannons", because it annoyed benos.
    They removed instant remote controlled explosives, because it annoyed benos.
    They nerfed fucking melee, because it annoyed benos.
    They increased cade metal cost and removed materials crate from ASRS, because FoBs annoyed benos.
    Wanna dance more?
    Most of those changes were for the balance, some were truly, because beno acid tears.
    Not even talking about gorillion changes to make benos hunt preds easier. Giving any room that a predator can go up and shit beno day will never exist, because benos hate having to deal with anything beyond one click abilities. They hate Queen, they hate other benos, they hate lack of weeds, they hate their own structures, they hate anything that truly gets in the way of TDM as benos are LRP.
    REDEMPTION

  4. #4
    Whitelisted Predator ChainsawMullet's Avatar
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    Pretty sure the pred you saw was me.

    Anyway, that guy I was pushing got mad about it and wanted a fight, we had a good bout and he unironically almost killed me because holy fuck I'm not used to 12 fps clicking. The reason most preds try to provoke people like that is because it's just not interesting fighting someone who has no interest in fighting you, at least if you make them mad and get them to start the fight you know they actually want you dead and probably won't run. If a pred tries to start a fight, the marine will just walk away or run straight into FOB or something, because they know preds won't touch them if they get behind some cades.

    As a pred it can be incredibly annoying trying to find someone to fight, there's a couple pred hunters around but I very rarely encounter them personally, and who can blame them for not trying anymore? Most of the time if a good player fights a pred the pred will just get mad and LPC/HPC them and then run away.

    So yeah, part of it is that some marines are cowards, but it cuts both ways and there's plenty of cowardly preds.

    Personally, if you see my pred ingame, feel free to start shooting, I'll fight with you generally as long as it's not inside a cadeline or there's 3 gorillion marines.

    (You can generally spot me as the pred wearing marine helmets/berets/whatever the last person I hunted was wearing on their head).


    Honourable hunter Rhuu'Nhon ready to hunt a powerful and worthy adversary from two klicks back.



    Claymore enthusiast & specialist Hylla Humphrey-Hubert.
    Unrobust click clack Rhuu'Nhon.

  5. #5
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    I don't want this to be a balance thread but most of those changes on both sides were mostly to get away from the classic ss13 "get stunned once and GG" and I think they've been pretty successful at it. for instance pain was too strong, it might have been slightly over nerfed but its better than a hardened marine buwning his poor widdle arm and falling down crying untill someone else kisses his boo boo. Instant, at will, strong explosions pretty much kill an alien with no counter play which is kinda lame.

    Quote Originally Posted by CABAL View Post
    I don't know from where you get that idea, but pred can fuck you up even if you didn't provoke him.
    This actually shocks me. I saw a thread where a pred got banned from the role. He was fighting someone in melee, and knocked them down with a ranged attack and threw away their riot shield. I mean it was dishonorable but that was it, the guy lost his whitelist.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChainsawMullet View Post
    Personally, if you see my pred ingame, feel free to start shooting
    I know that I can but thats my point. As a marine preds feel like an entirely optional side quest. They seem like a neutral 3rd party instead of a hostile force, and it just feels lame and immersion breaking. I might start shooting preds on sight just out of principle but like... I want to want to shoot them you get me? I don't want to shoot them just cuz I feel like it.

  6. #6
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    Diseases/infections were removed because according to staff they "caused server lag".
    Felix the Synth: hat fanatic, nice robot, one time double agent almayer synth executed for sedition. Occasional murderous mopbot.

  7. #7
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    Its weird to me that so many people think theres conspiracies among the coders to buff/nerf humans/xenos.

    Anyway I read the rules, and maybe the "problem" is that preds can't really engage groups of marines. Cant use lethal guns unless they're dishonorable, just supposed to stun and kite them.

    I dunno. I know theres a lot of people who are actually involved with preds that don't see any issues. Maybe I'm the problem and I should be purging non human scum.

  8. #8
    Mod Manager ThesoldierLLJK's Avatar
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    Role with a dumb hamstring honorcode that needs to be mechanically fixed or scrapped.*
    Change my mind






    *MY OWN OPINION NOT OPINION OF MANAGEMENT
    Head Shitposter in Charge and Current Mod Manager
    Insert timeline of being staff here | Discord: Thesoldier#3107 - Open to DMs

  9. #9
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    Sorry for posting so much, but this just happened:

    Right outside medbay on big red. A pred just standing around. 4 or so other marines standing by him. I say "Wow a non human with tons of weapons. Guess I'll just ignore him." Start walking past. Turn around. Point at him and say "I'm shooting you in 10 seconds." Pull out my gun. He punches me down. I stand up and shoot him. He crits me with a glaive. I get revived.

    PFC Roxi Kadel says, "Don't shoot the jamaican"
    PFC Roxi Kadel says, "You bald bastard"

    Everyone just standing around.

    I shoot him again. Critted again. Get revived in FOB.

    This is a problem. Preds just fucking hang out. Literally. Just standing around. Nobody cares. Pred barely cares I shot him. Marines don't care at all. Everyone knows you just don't fight preds. You just fucking stand around and "RP"

    What a fucking joke. Preds are clowns.

  10. #10
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    *laugh3
    Lily Izayoi - USCM

    LI-XXX-L1 - Xeno

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