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Thread: On the upcoming CO/XO merge and its effect on current shipside RP

  1. #51
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    Another reason why I think RP standards have dropped is the strengthening of medical, and the subsequent effect on marine mentality.

    As a medic, I can heal almost everything. Splints have no downside (movement speed pffft), I can heal IB with a bica OD, defib is super easy, custom drug mixes can get bonkers, every marine is carrying his "unga juice" and first aid injectors, and research gives us custom drugs that can kill larvae or mend bones and organ damage. Remember when we nerfed QC because it could instantly cure something that the devs wanted to be resolved shipside? I remember.

    I can pump a marine full of peridaxon, tramadol and tricordrazine and send him on his way, and he'll be fine for a while, until the next medic tops him up with peridaxon and away he goes. Meanwhile doctors just shove every case into the autodoc because half of them don't know how to do surgery properly anymore. Nobody evacs, so nobody has to spend time sitting on their hands. That's when RP gets done, when there's no aliens to click. We all know RPing in the middle of a fight is a bad idea, so we RP shipside while we're being treated or waiting on the transport. But that doesn't happen anymore because Unga McDunga wants to keep clicking aliens while he has no lungs. /rant

    TL;DR. I'm a medic main and I want medical nerfed.

    On the topic of merging XO and CO, it's stupid. If the current chain of command remains the same, the moment the CO is incapacitated (killed by a shipside runner, logs out, AFKs, decides to unga instead of do his job, the usual), the Chief Engineer takes charge. Half the Chief Engineers don't want to do anything, let alone lead the op. So they'll duck out, next is the RO, who has their own department to run. CMP, who half the time only plays MP so doesn't understand the ground game, then we get to SOs. SOs are a mixed bag, and if I'm reading this right, won't have access to the techweb.

  2. #52
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    This is just decisively false and a systematic problem within the Dev team. You as a developer are supposed to create a world filled with lore, mechanics and features that promotes a player to roleplay.
    Every system, feature, content and mechanic adding to the game should be looked at in two perspective.

    1. Does this improve the game?
    2. What is the social impact on this? (RP)

    For the last few years, the second check for content hasn't been done. In fact CM Dev over the past few years have spent so long shoving arcade mechanics into the game that it has degraded RP so excessively it's caused an ethic change in the playerbase.

    So you're right, the playerbase itself as of today is very anti-RP and just wants to shoot shit.

    But this is the Dev Team's fault as they for the last few years have been promoting the game to be a shooter, arcade and "moba". During this time, existing RP features/mechanics have been removed, neglected and simply nothing added to compensate.

    So your argument that the player base is to blame for the level of RP on the server is honestly fucking stupid.
    I don't know how else to say this, but the Dev/Staff Team have PUSHED to the playerbase to be anti-rp and memey.


    Every RP game in existence (DnD, Tabletops, Cardgames, RP Online Games) has heavy moderation to keep players focused towards proper behavior and actions. This is backed up by the game mechanics that encourage and ACTIVELY PROMOTE Roleplay features and actions. The constant argument from Devs that "Players" must make the RP is so fucking deluded and stupid that it pains me that I spent 4years working on this game only to see morons spew that shit.

    The problem is very clear as to why RP is the way it is in present day and this post from a current Dev is exact evidence. Little concept to how RP works, how to implement and the complete acceptance of "RP" doesn't work so fuck it attitude.

    But hey, don't take my word for it?
    Read Hunks post above to state similar things I'm parroting
    How about a senior Dev who is openly anti-RP? rp.PNG
    Or let's check our Soldiers comments about how theres a lack of cohesion? https://cm-ss13.com/forums/showthrea...good-job/page5


    To summarize, the Dev team spent the last 3 years forcing arcade mechanics into a game that was roleplay while failing to nurture any RP mechanics. This caused the player-base to shift towards anti-rp as the game they're playing is largely an action shooter with low-rp now.

    You're right, this is an exhausting conversation and a horse I've beaten dead at this point. I just want you to understand where the blame is to be pointed at and you trying to turn it around and blame the very playerbase that you caused to be anti-RP/Toxic is so fucking deluded.

    This isn't even touching-base with the Staff/Moderation side of things either, but to be honest I find it irrelevant to enforce RP in a game where the Dev team actively works against any measures of RP and just shits on the Staff teams moderation ability. Trust me, I have a huge fucking complaint with the whitelisting and it's arguably awful given the whitelisted players actively stating shit like "lol fuk RP".
    to summarize, this is an incredibly entitled take

    First off, CM is a game maintained by VOLUNTEER developers who dedicate our time to working on the game, not slaves to some bygone vision of what the game WAS in the past.
    I don't enjoy roleplay on CM as a player or as a developer. I don't think that just because CM was a game heavily focused on RP in the past means it has to be one in the future.
    The CM I have come to know has been from the start a TDM first and a roleplay game second, and I have gotten a ton of fun out of creating new and fun TDM mechanics for the game.
    The idea that the game is somehow "truly" an RP game that has been "corrupted" by Devs introducing "arcade" mechanics is founded on the idea that CM belongs to the people who originally created it, people who without exception have moved on from - or were forced out of - the community. CM does not belong to those people, it belongs to the people currently working on it and maintaining it, not to cynical spectators who want the server to stay trapped in its past.

    If you want to blame me and the people who work with me for degrading RP, go ahead - I admit it. I have actively worked to create a game that is fun not because of RP, but on its own merits as a TDM game.
    Fact is, most players, myself included, want a TDM, and I am catering to them, not to boomers. Simple As.

  3. #53
    Senior Member Stan_albatross's Avatar
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    3 hour rounds

    idk about you but I don't want to play any game basically non-stop for 3 hours

    let alone 4 or 5

    and god forbid you were to permadie to metadragging lurkers 20 minutes in.

    especially when half of those 3 hours are spent talking to alphas behind a cadeline or slowly dying in medbay/the dropship/the fob
    Karl Karlsson, the man who is (probably) good at everything

    Maxwell the synth, the robot who wants your metal and always recycles
    11/9/20 : Synth WL, 13/9/20 : Mentor, 6/10/20 : Discord Volunteer (first one)


  4. #54
    Senior Member Papa_Pollard's Avatar
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    Dev dudes right, We dont roleplay for shit. Most of the marines dont even type with the exception getting something from req or calling out xeno locations.

    And all this shit people are saying about how roleplays dead due to balance and whatever like nah. You choose how you play if you just wanna run around with 2 shotties typing cringe every time you kill a lurker go for it but don't act like the devs or admins are forcing you to do that. If your thinking "ah shit but how else am I meant to kill xenos and win" well then thats the problem you've made the server and rounds all about winning and yea sure since its a TDM that kinda is the whole point but its not a TDM like cod or any of that other shit, theres no pay-off or reward for winning so like why bother making that your goal for the round?

    What im trying to say like an fuckin retard is, if Players wanna roleplay they can and if it really matters to you then yea you can actually be robust and roleplay.

    And another thing im gonna just spout more shit here. Shipside roleplay doesn't fuckin exist. I've never once seen the CMO have doctors and shit in the conference room giving them a TED talk during the gap between first drop and surgery. Instead they just buckle into a seat tab out and watch youtube for a bit, its not the devs or the game telling them to do that its their choice. The whole point of roleplay is that you make it what it is, if players are just not roleplaying then thats the players fault.
    CM's just a server that lets you shoot stuff the reasons for how you play it the way you do are all your own.

    if you've actually bothered reading all the shit ive said then nice my dude

  5. #55
    Senior Member SilentMountain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fourkhan View Post
    snip
    "This is an entitled take but also everything you said is true" Lmao

    Also this logic :

    Quote Originally Posted by Fourkhan View Post
    CM does not belong to those people, it belongs to the people currently working on it and maintaining it
    Is beyond flawed.

    So CM "belongs" to whoever is currently in the dev team ? Long as I got the "Developer" tag I can inject whatever I please into the game with absolutely no thought for the game's culture, playerbase or even the damn impact the shit im putting in will have into the gameplay because "lol muh TDM".

    People here dont need to be "trapped in the past" or "boomers" or whatever cope you guys come up with to see that trying to force a MOBA style mass PvP into a SS13 server is simply not gonna work, you stripped the game down to the bones and all you have to show for it is still-laggy combat that is based around stun locking players and rounds that are all identical to each other. Nor the combat nor gameplay are any better than before all the TDM changes were introduced, in fact sometimes worse, and the only real everlasting and profound change was that you did away with RP. Literally nothing was gained from all of this.

    I swear you people are like 2 posts away from "Make your own game then" retorts.
    Last edited by SilentMountain; 10-09-2020 at 05:08 PM.

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fourkhan View Post
    to summarize, this is an incredibly entitled take
    If you want to blame me and the people who work with me for degrading RP, go ahead - I admit it. I have actively worked to create a game that is fun not because of RP, but on its own merits as a TDM game.
    Fact is, most players, myself included, want a TDM, and I am catering to them, not to boomers. Simple As.
    I'm not sure what's more entitled.

    Joining a staff team for an RP game, being opposed to RP and then actively/intentionally degrading RP to fit your own desire for a pre-established game.

    How you can admit to intentionally degrading the RP element of a game for years and then state the player-base wants an Arcade TDM after years of intentional degradation is mind-numbing.
    This is gas-lighting, you intentionally set out to remove/degrade RP and now you're acting like the player-base is in large (or always was) for TDM.
    The current player-base is for TDM because people like you, have pushed the playerbase towards that edge for years. Don't act like this is something that was always desired, but rather a product of your own doing.

    This is despicable, how people like you are on the staff team, let alone the Dev team is the catalyst to poor Leadership within CM as you would've instantly been removed years ago for this post alone.
    rp.PNG

    And your right, the game doesn't belong to anyone, not me nor apop. But it's fucking sad to see a product of creation, passion and hardwork ruined by selfish staff members like you who only develop what "they want" and not what the playerbase wants.

    Fucking despicable and inexcusable.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fourkhan View Post
    to summarize, this is an incredibly entitled take

    First off, CM is a game maintained by VOLUNTEER developers who dedicate our time to working on the game, not slaves to some bygone vision of what the game WAS in the past.
    I don't enjoy roleplay on CM as a player or as a developer. I don't think that just because CM was a game heavily focused on RP in the past means it has to be one in the future.
    The CM I have come to know has been from the start a TDM first and a roleplay game second, and I have gotten a ton of fun out of creating new and fun TDM mechanics for the game.
    The idea that the game is somehow "truly" an RP game that has been "corrupted" by Devs introducing "arcade" mechanics is founded on the idea that CM belongs to the people who originally created it, people who without exception have moved on from - or were forced out of - the community. CM does not belong to those people, it belongs to the people currently working on it and maintaining it, not to cynical spectators who want the server to stay trapped in its past.

    If you want to blame me and the people who work with me for degrading RP, go ahead - I admit it. I have actively worked to create a game that is fun not because of RP, but on its own merits as a TDM game.
    Fact is, most players, myself included, want a TDM, and I am catering to them, not to boomers. Simple As.
    So you saw something that other people spent hours of their lives building and making enjoyable for a community of people and decided that you didn't like it, so instead of making something that you could enjoy with your own community, you took what those people made, and fucked it up beyond recognition? But the people complaining you did that are the entitled ones? Fucking brilliant, man.

  8. #58
    Predator Council Member Survivor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fewher View Post
    I'm not sure what's more entitled.

    Joining a staff team for an RP game, being opposed to RP and then actively/intentionally degrading RP to fit your own desire for a pre-established game.

    How you can admit to intentionally degrading the RP element of a game for years and then state the player-base wants an Arcade TDM after years of intentional degradation is mind-numbing.
    This is gas-lighting, you intentionally set out to remove/degrade RP and now you're acting like the player-base is in large (or always was) for TDM.
    The current player-base is for TDM because people like you, have pushed the playerbase towards that edge for years. Don't act like this is something that was always desired, but rather a product of your own doing.

    This is despicable, how people like you are on the staff team, let alone the Dev team is the catalyst to poor Leadership within CM as you would've instantly been removed years ago for this post alone.
    rp.PNG

    And your right, the game doesn't belong to anyone, not me nor apop. But it's fucking sad to see a product of creation, passion and hardwork ruined by selfish staff members like you who only develop what "they want" and not what the playerbase wants.

    Fucking despicable and inexcusable.
    CM changed when people stopped getting permabanned for having a differing opinion than certain individuals.

  9. #59
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    Kneejerk and namecalling is pretty telling

    when I joined staff the server was already noRP TDM so I dont see how I have any responsibility to preserve your vision of the server as MRP

    believe it or not my perspective actually is - and always has been - based on what players have asked me to change/improve about the game, its not like my perspective came from nowhere but rather evolved based on the people I interacted with while I was forming my opinions about CM. The majority of players during my entire tenure on staff have been asking for more TDM mechanics etc, not less

  10. #60
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    All I can say is that someone has to create their own server with whatever was in 2016 + better usability features and POPLOCK THE FUCK OUT OF IT

    Then you will have your old roleplay, then you will have your old fear, old 3-4-5-6 hour rounds

    I will even help you

    You might have hyperactive 1-1.5 hour rounds with 2018 balance that MattAtlas and I made when we two were working on it. Again, have separate server, I'm 100% sure devs from here will help you. Fuck, I will even host you.

    Thing is, current CM is built for fun of the masses. If we become scary roleplaying experience, why the fuck you not join bay or another high-rp server? It's not that I want to sound entitled, it's just that we are incompatible. It's like being in a bad relationship, noone is having fun. Coders are getting burned out on your shit, and you are getting burned on our responses and think we are some entitled brats that make _your_ game suck or _your_ experience suck.

    Let's solve it. You want RP based spooky game? Let's make it. The code is open, the people who coded most of it are here. But both servers have right to exist.

    We can't say 1000's of people to gtfo or change their style because we suddenly want to go back to 2016 or 2018 without retraining mods/admins, brainwashing devs into submission and basically alienating non-vocal majority that just wants to have fun pew-pewing xenos.

    I will never tell people to NOT RP on CM. RPing on CM is actually fun. Even as marine.
    But in the heat of combat, in the heat of pewpew of two massive armies, noone will give two shits of a fuck about lone marine roleplaying ACTUALLY having pain.

    Sorry for going offtopic from initial convo, but holy shit this topic is tiresome

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