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Thread: Basedoperator - Rule 2, 3 and 16.

  1. #1
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    Basedoperator - Rule 2, 3 and 16.

    Player Report
    Your Byond ID?
    Jade_Pearl

    Date of Incident
    October 19, 2020

    Your Character Name?
    Elly 'Lizard' Luckwing

    Accused Byond Key(if known):
    Basedoperator

    Accused Character Name
    Daniel Morgan

    Approximate time and date of the incident (Central US Time for fastest results)
    Round ended at 21:05 central us time or 03:08 CEST.

    What rule(s) were broken:
    Rule 2, 3 and 16.

    Description of the incident:
    I was a bravo engineer doing my normal prep, getting my equipement before moving down to briefing. Briefing was suprisingly packed, thankfully, and several new pvt's had showed up too. We were just talking and then the conversation moved over to how to hug peeps and how to high five them. In looc I explained how to do it and then a pvt by the name of Lenny Robertson tries to do the same. Sadly he had both his gun wielded AND was in hostage taking mode rather than mere firing mode. As such, instead of giving the person in front of them, Silas Shane, a high five they pointed their gun at them. Silas, scared, moved back causing Lenny to fire a burst into Silas. Chaos ensued and several marines started disarming and punching Lenny. One of them the delta medic Kendra Barret who repeatedly punched Lenny, at that point disarmed and on the floor. An LT shows up, Richard Maynard, that positions himself on top of Lenny to block the punches and keep the marines at bay, most stop but Kendra keeps on punching. The LT grabs Lenny and stars pulling him away from the marines, most stop punching but Kendra persists, following the LT and Lenny. I continuosly body block Kendra till I eventually resort to disarming Kendra who subsequently falls down. Daniel shows up, pulls out his Mateba and then tries to BE me on the spot, not Kendra, he aimed for my chest so it failed. I survive, Daniel is quiet and doesnt talk to me again. I am in the dropship, I ask Daniel why I was, essentially, BE'd. He replied with 'you were starting a riot after I was screaming to stop punching'.

    I may be mistaken but screaming 'stop punching' and body blocking the only person that was still acting agressivly, Kendra, doesn't sound to me like 'inciting a riot'. At the moment of attempted execution the riot had already been quelled, as you can see from the attack logs. Furthermore, when Daniel got his CO wl a little under 2 months ago he wrote that: '[...]the battlefield execution should only be used in scenarios where it is absolutely necessary, such as an immediate lethal major threat to the safety of yourself, your men, and the operation, and one that cannot be handled by MPs or through standard execution protocol without further jeopardy and harm.' I dont see how me screaming to stop or, at worst, body blocking and disarming somebody once can be counted as a 'major threat'. Let alone how the LT dragging Lenny away failed. BE is described as a last resort yet I feel there's been a shocking lack of trying alternatives such as, for instance, using the briefing flasher.

    Time goes on, I deploy and fob construction is well underway, I dont remember how long after this went down but lets say 10 minutes I hear from Donald again. He goes out of his way to tell me that he feels bad that he 'didn't get to shoot your[mine] head off'. Now, I get that rule 3 doens't mean that you can't say bad things but I feel that going out of your way to tell me several minutes later that you're sad that you didn't get to execute me takes thing a tad too far.

    This brings me to my last point, rule 2 'roleplay'. Going out of your way to express your sadness about being unable to execute me is not something you'd expect the CO of a marine vessel to do. Especially one that, in his app, described himself as being calm and collected as well as saying ''I think it's important that you don't sour your image with the marines even more with hasty PBing and detaining, or other spiteful actions.'

    Lastly I wish to state that I am both sick and writing this at 4am so I am sorry if my grammar isn't thebest. Also, since *technically speaking* he merely shot me instead of BE'ng me, although his later comments very much suggest that was his intention, I am more than willing to exchange the misuse of the BE for an improper escalation one.

    Evidence (screenshots, logs, etc):
    How you would punish the accused:
    Give him a whitelist suspension or maybe even take it away. BE's are a powerful tool not to be wasted and CO is the beacon of roleplay on the server with rules stating that you must always be in character. It is my belief that he failed to live up to that standard.

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    Rule 2 doesn't apply. Rule 3 doesn't either because of the IC issue. You were very clearly instigating the situation in your own screenshots by assaulting and crowding around after I told everyone to stop punching and back away (shoving and assaulting) and the MPs were unable to control the situation and detain because of your riling actions. Your meta-clique decided to interfere and prevent the BE. Play stupid games and win stupid prizes. I've been allowed and authorized to BE people for less before especially during a chaotic briefing like that. Seems like a very grudgey report especially with the requesting a WL removal on first offense. Perhaps you should cool down before writing one of these.
    Last edited by Basedoperator; 10-20-2020 at 02:51 AM.

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    It was very clear from the beginning that Elly was trying to break up the fight. I saw the entire thing and mostly stayed out of it.

    From what I saw, Daniel Morgan (Basedoperator) did not try at all the quell the rioting in a intelligent matter. Despite verbal warnings and orders clearly not working, he resorted straight to violence. I did fax High Command about his assault with a deadly weapon/attempted murder, but no response was given. Not only that, but the ONLY person they shot was Elly, the one nonofficer trying to break up the fight, and then later kept on berating the poor girl over Bravo radio. He did NOT show any regards to the RP standards set by other Commanding Officers, did NOT use nonlethal options (SUCH AS THE BRIEFING FLASH), did NOT accurately assess the situation (as it is clear by his response that he blames Elly), and did NOT maintain maturity or self control. Instead they chose to try to EXECUTE Elly for a fight she did not cause for reasons that were not conceived in a rational manner. These, in my opinion, would reflect very poorly on the rest of the Commanding Officers.

    And to add to the nail in the coffin, a Staff Officer also stepped in to break up the fighting, but they did not get so much as a stern glance thrown their way despite their actions aligning with that of Elly's: breaking up the fight. They are not an MP. They cannot perform MP duties without proper appointment, and they are certainly not more innocent than Elly. To which both parties are devoid of crime. Elly did not start the fight, nor was she given the chance to end it, and given Basedoperator's doubling down on his action and even blatantly tries to gas light Elly in the above post (telling her she is not of sound mind). Being a third party member to this, I firmly standby the decision to take disciplinary action against the moderator in question.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guprei View Post
    From what I saw, Daniel Morgan (Basedoperator) did not try at all the quell the rioting in a intelligent matter. Despite verbal warnings and orders clearly not working, he resorted straight to violence.
    You contradicted your own testimony.

    Quote Originally Posted by Guprei View Post
    but the ONLY person they shot was Elly, the one nonofficer trying to break up the fight
    The only person continuing to escalate the situation after warnings.

    Quote Originally Posted by Guprei View Post
    And to add to the nail in the coffin, a Staff Officer also stepped in to break up the fighting, but they did not get so much as a stern glance thrown their way despite their actions aligning with that of Elly's: breaking up the fight.
    An officer versus an enlisted trying to quell a fight. You do the math.

    Quote Originally Posted by Guprei View Post
    and even blatantly tries to gas light Elly in the above post (telling her she is not of sound mind).
    You know this is a video game right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guprei View Post
    I firmly standby the decision to take disciplinary action against the moderator in question. .
    This is a player report, not a staff report.
    Last edited by Basedoperator; 10-20-2020 at 03:38 AM.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    You contradicted your own testimony.
    It is not a contradiction to expect a Commanding Officer to try to stop a riot, not commit a murder.


    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    The only person continuing to escalate the situation after warnings.
    They were also not attacking the victim, rather trying to stop someone else who was.


    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    An officer versus an enlisted trying to quell a fight. You do the math.
    Strange how when it comes to forums, you point out that it is a game, but when it comes to the round you treat it as real life. Staff Officer is a role any random person can choose, as is engineer. They aren't a real officer nor did they have to go through any kind of training to actually earn the position. If you want to make it IC, how about let's talk about the senior officer who tried to execute an enlisted for trying to break up a fight. Or how about same said senior officer berating the Marine over the radio in front of their squad despite 0 aggression from the Marine? No officer would keep their position after that, let alone return to the ship.


    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    You know this is a video game right?
    Not player reports. I don't think I have to explain to you why these things exist. Nor do I think that I have to explain to you that gas lighting and trying to twist the other person up emotionally is justifiable in any capacity.


    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    This is a player report, not a staff report.
    So I guess I am not allowed to recognize your position as a moderator? Next you are going to tell me that pushing someone is a capital offense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guprei View Post
    They were also not attacking the victim, rather trying to stop someone else who was.
    No.

    Quote Originally Posted by Guprei View Post
    Strange how when it comes to forums, you point out that it is a game, but when it comes to the round you treat it as real life. Staff Officer is a role any random person can choose, as is engineer. They aren't a real officer nor did they have to go through any kind of training to actually earn the position. If you want to make it IC, how about let's talk about the senior officer who tried to execute an enlisted for trying to break up a fight. Or how about same said senior officer berating the Marine over the radio in front of their squad despite 0 aggression from the Marine? No officer would keep their position after that, let alone return to the ship.
    Not real life, just common sense. You're arguing semantics.

    Quote Originally Posted by Guprei View Post
    Not player reports. I don't think I have to explain to you why these things exist. Nor do I think that I have to explain to you that gas lighting and trying to twist the other person up emotionally is justifiable in any capacity.
    Quote Originally Posted by Guprei View Post
    So I guess I am not allowed to recognize your position as a moderator? Next you are going to tell me that pushing someone is a capital offense.
    what

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    No.
    Uh, yes? Disarming isn't an attack. Unless you mean to say that a MP that has to baton a resisting Marine is attacking them.


    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    Not real life, just common sense. You're arguing semantics.
    It's common sense to not treat people as disposable cannon fodder you can merk at your own leisure. Guess you didn't get the memo.



    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperatpr View Post
    what
    I referred to you by your position, moderator, and you said it was a player report, not a staff report.




    Now to address your earlier comment some more.

    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    Rule 2 doesn't apply.
    You tried to execute a Marine for trying to stop a fight. You then berated them later in front of their squad. A senior officer does not act like that at all if they are professional in any capacity. Rule 2 would apply under this interpretation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    Rule 3 doesn't either because of the IC issue.
    You not only tried to execute them and remove their character from the round over a noncapital crime, but you then berated them over comms where the rest of the squad could see without provocation from the Marine. Rule 3 would also be applicable in a scenario like this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    You were very clearly instigating the situation in your own screenshots by assaulting and crowding around after I told everyone to stop punching and back away (shoving and assaulting) and the MPs were unable to control the situation and detain because of your riling actions.
    To instigate is to start, and if you HONESTLY THINK that Elly started a riot just to try to end it then at that point I question your ability to be reasoned with. Not only that, but you did not help the MPs either. Instead you tried to kill a Marine. You were standing next to a button designed to stop riots. Fucking use it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    Your meta-clique decided to interfere and prevent the BE.
    I guess trying to save someone's life and being a decent person makes me a meta-roleplayer? I would have done the same had anyone else been in Elly's situation. Hell, if I was the SL I would have put you on your ass for attacking Marines unprovoked.

    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    Play stupid games and win stupid prizes.
    Oh is this the alleged video game you were talking about? If so, I guess you won the stupid prize of being reported.

    Quote Originally Posted by Basedoperator View Post
    I've been allowed and authorized to BE people for less before especially during a chaotic briefing like that. Seems like a very grudgey report especially with the requesting a WL removal on first offense. Perhaps you should cool down before writing one of these.
    You can't try to lump this BE with others. The situation was not clear nor were you in the right. Not to mention I was the one in the round taking a firm stance on everything and encouraged Elly to take action. But since you are so keen on being right, I guess you already knew that.

    And, as stated before, gas lighting is bad. Don't try to make someone question their own reality to make yourself seem clean. That just looks really bad to everyone else.

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    I'm not going to bother to continue arguing with someone so invested in something they were barely involved in, pretty clear cognitive bias for a friend of yours. I'll let the logs show the proof. You deciding to interfere in a BE and then threatening to "kick my ass" shows pretty clear you don't understand what you're talking about.

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    I was gunny this round. Was busy teaching a new player and a new engineer so I only really paid attention on the aftermath of it.
    There was a scuffle in the briefing area and if I recall correctly, either a delta or a bravo told me to go to the dropship on the grounds of "command wanting to execute bravo engi". I didn't pay much attention prior to this and I didn't see too much at this point, only that there was complaining about MPs shooting, and a briefing shooter. I remember bravo specifically being disapproving of the CO.
    I went over to DS1, everything seemed fine(some banter and blood, but no active encounter), so I walked away. Not big deal from there, I was busy teaching some new players over mhelp on macros and also some other things went on, such as two deltas pbing each other on the ship, and a chemistry bomber. Now ICly, any officer who has to brandish a hand gun for a non capital crime / non pressing issue and shoot it is a terrible officer. It destroys cohesion and ruins the bond of the enlisted and the officer, which is usually already strained. It essentially is a showing factor that an officer lacks the leadership, tact, and charisma to bring an inside-company scuffle to tamer terms. Using a gun for a fistfight dispute is poor leadership, these are fear and intimidation tactics used by second or third class militaries. That said, an e-7 in the marines does not give a shit about company CO business, that's for the e-8 and e-9 and I was not an e-9 at the time.

    Some time down the line morgan was like "I am so sorry I didn't get to blow your head off" which is not only adding fuel to the fire, but extremely unbecoming of an officer. It's already bad that an officer has to pull a gun and use it to break up a fistfight and an argument; but this can be potentially understood if placed into the context of the heat of the moment, mistakes sometimes happen.

    However, what cannot be understood is after the fact that everything has cooled down and it's an hour into the mission, then being remorseful as a company commander about not being able to kill(in a derogatory manner especially) one of your enlisted marines, and stating so publicly over squad comms. That's literal dogshit leadership, borderline insane and battalion command would ice him instantly. Something like this would make it up to regimental or even divisional command. Stating such a thing would be mutiny inciting and every NCO and JCO in the company would be disapproving of it. You would destroy every single bit of cohesion in that company. Not a single marine would serve under such a leader and it would paint an ugly picture for the entire USCM to the point where they'd most likely try to cover it up while relieving the CO of his command, handing it off to the XO and then court martialling them. The end result would be a demotion or discharge for sure.

    That's how it'd be IC.
    Anyways, as for my OOC opinion, I can agree that rules 2(theres not a chance in the world that a CO would be permitted to act like this, furthermore no chance that they'd get away with it once discovered) and 16(there was literally no pressing threat or danger, especially not from bravo engi, the briefing pvt maybe if anything.) were broken, 3 is iffy. We have a plethora of incompetent COs as everyone in CM has probably seen at one point or another, however I can agree with 3 due to BasedOperator's first post, it was rather passive aggressive in my honest opinion; no offence

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