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Thread: araclain - WL issue

  1. #1
    Ceyella
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    araclain - WL issue

    Player Report
    Your Byond ID?
    Ceyella

    Date of Incident
    January 8, 2021

    Your Character Name?
    Ceyella Meer

    Accused Byond Key(if known):
    araclain

    Accused Character Name
    Brooke Wells

    Approximate time and date of the incident (Central US Time for fastest results)
    1:30am

    What rule(s) were broken:
    WL issue

    Description of the incident:
    CO woke up mid op, ran into CIC, me and uh, aremis tried to give updates, he made a command announcement demanding everyone give him cats.

    me and aremis wordlessly kept command tried to help ground.

    CO made several more annoucements detailing cats, completely throwing off ground. I couldnt get announcements in about flanks due to CO sitting in bubble sperging about cats.

    several people brought him cats, he then talked about cat RPGs with C4, totally blew off command, doing anything, went crazy LRP to dive head first into some weird cat cult. saying we get cats instead of medals now.

    Did nothing at all to command or lead, until i bugged him to buy us more OB, he bought req points and made some minor commments, seemed like he was getting into it... then fell back into cat LRP until crash.

    Nordica and alot of known-names were on this OP and saw how CO fucked off to LRP cat-cult

    Evidence (screenshots, logs, etc):
    https://imgur.com/a/clN8xbY

    chat scroll took alot these are the few, but not all i could save.

    How you would punish the accused:
    if anyone as XO did this, they would be Jbanned, but i doubt the WL will remove a CO for severe LRP and neglect of command.

  2. #2
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    I spawned a large number of cats in the ASRS elevator during the round.
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  3. #3
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    Hi me was Delta SL this round. I didn't even know that CO woke up until they did their announcements and command radio comms about cats. I don't believe they said a *single* thing about the groundside operation, orders wise ect. I don't think they had any actual intent to assist marines. They gave bravo SL Elizabeth Decker a medal, so maybe pull logs for that, as they might've been communicating then. I don't know, man. Maybe they said like, a single thing in delta comms the entire time, if it matters. We also had a xeno research scenario going on, but I'm not sure if they were woken by that time.

  4. #4
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    Get ready and find yourself a cat to pet, because you're going to need it.

    Ship announcements and tablet announcements do not share a cooldown with the command console. Your ability to continue the operation exactly as it had been was diminished by approximately 0%. The accusation that I did "nothing to command" is blatantly untrue and, quite frankly, a lie. This was an operation in which...

    ASRS was constantly spawning cats

    Crabs were everywhere

    We had xenos in containment (who I went and Mateba'd to death, by way, if you were wondering where I was)

    AND THE CIC WAS BEING BLOWN UP BY A BOMBER ON THE LOOSE

    This is not to mention the fact that 90% of what I was being told by req and the shipside crew was about cats. You had clearly been in command of the CIC for the *90 minutes of the round before I latejoined* (it was not "midgame"--we were right at the end, sieged at the FOB). I'm of the opinion that it's a little bit rude for the latejoin CO to show up and start telling the hard-working aCOs how to play the game. I very intentionally *didn't do that,* although I tend give as few direct orders as possible when playing CO anyway. It made me sense for me to focus on shipside matters. The fact that this report has been filed at all is utterly baffling to me, not for the least reason that you appear to be actively lying about nearly everything you've mentioned. So let me go through the finer points of your report one at a time.

    CO woke up mid op, ran into CIC, me and uh, aremis tried to give updates, he made a command announcement demanding everyone give him cats.
    This is certainly a hot take. It bares next to no resemblance to reality. Let me explain to you what actually happened:

    >Woke up
    >Went to the CIC, saying, I recall, "I'm running this monkey farm now"
    >Ask over comms "what the fuck is happening"
    >Proceed to be bombarded with all of the shipside crew telling me we had a million cats
    >Ignore it, because that seems unlikely
    >Keep being told about cats
    >Everyone mentions cats
    >Issue order for the cats to be brought to the CIC OVER COMMAND COMMS, DIRECTLY TO THE RO (because, incidentally, I didn't want to have to leave the CIC to go dick around for too long; it was not an announcement)
    >Proceed to see that there are literally at least a dozen cats
    >This creates an engaging, if very silly, bit of roleplaying for tons of crewmembers, all of whom decide to hang out in the CIC at their own volition
    >Try to manage this cat-astrophic situation in a way that would make the CO council proud (and, at the sage advising of the CMP, make sure that no one starts murdering cats for no reason. That would be actually lRP.)

    me and aremis wordlessly kept command tried to help ground.
    For future reference, you may have more success winning rounds as aCO if you communicate using words. Wordless communication is extremely inefficient. I would even be so bold as to claim that there is no such thing when playing SS13.

    I couldnt get announcements in about flanks due to CO sitting in bubble sperging about cats.
    Tablet and shipside announcements do not share a CD with the central console. This is literally a lie. Your own screenshot shows me not using the central console for my sillier announcements. Furthermore, you are absolutely delusional if you think marines would have somehow clinched a victory from an obviously lost round because of your one big time flank announcement---in a dead-end siege, no less--and it was DEFINITELY THE LATEJOIN CO'S FAULT THAT WE LOST GUYS. You are aware that you still have squad comms, right?

    Finally, and I hate to break it to you, being bad isn't against the rules. The CO WL is not about winning rounds. It never has been. We laugh at people who file reports like this in the CO Discord.

    he then talked about cat RPGs with C4
    (citation needed--this didn't happen)

    totally blew off command, doing anything
    (citation needed)

    Anyway, I had other things on my mind upon latejoining, like making sure the round was fun for everyone or that we weren't being bombed by a griefer or that containment didn't fail or that this constantly spawning cat problem wasn't because of some crazy admin event that was going to result in the ship exploding spontaneously. The most important part of a CO's job, incidentally.

    There was hardly anything left for me to do in command; the operation was almost over. I spent a few minutes watching cams and made several announcements, such as reporting the queen's attack on the SE section of the FOB. I wasn't active on squad comms because I was busy doing other shit, and at some point there isn't much left for me to say--especially when there are two active overwatch officers. You may not be aware of this, but I only have two hands, and I can only deal with one thing at a time. When I latejoin, shipside matters, especially in a round with a shitload of fun shipside matters, are going to take priority. I am uniquely qualified to handle them. You can run the CIC just as well as I can.

    And anyway, if I really was inactive in command, which I wasn't in any meaningful sense, you should actually be happy--more room for you to lead us to victory, as you had been the entire round. If this premise is true, I don't see what you have to be upset about. I couldn't possibly have gotten in your way enough for my inaction to matter.

    Do you see how this is contradictory?

    Evidently, your issue is with the "LRP cat cult" and nothing to do with my comportment as aCO. So let's discuss that instead.

    went crazy LRP to dive head first into some weird cat cult
    You heard it here first, memers. Using the ammunition given to me by an admin is definitely "weird cat cult" behavior. CM13 is very serious business, after all. Dare to make an announcement referencing what's happening in the round? LRP! BAN HE! Literally, as a matter of fact. I mean wow.

    Let me set the record straight here and now: making a few announcements about our cat epidemic and ordering the crew NOT to pointlessly murder animals is not creating a "cult" in any sense of the word. Here's the definition of "cult," for ease of analysis, if anyone isn't certain...

    cult, noun: a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object.
    For those of us with ten years of SS13 to our names--actually 11 for me, dear God--we can very easily imagine what a real "LRP cat cult" might look like. Ordering men to wear cats on their heads into combat, executing people who touch cats, constantly spamming announcements about our new cat idols, etc. You will not that this is NOT AT ALL WHAT I DID WHATSOEVER. The fact that you are describing it in such a matter I can ascribe only to a blatant attempt at misinformation. That, or you're intoxicated, which is probable given the number of text errors in this above report and how little of a resemblance to reality this entire report bears.

    saying we get cats instead of medals now
    Okay I did say this (like once), and I don't regret it. That shit is hilarious and exclusively makes the round more fun for marines. It also provides a way for me to tie the admin RP opportunity back into mechanics of the game at large, creating cohesion between systems, players, and administrators.

    Finally, I would like to put forth the controversial claim that taking the meme an admin gives us and incorporating it into actual shipside RP is the opposite of lRP. The boring ass lRP thing would have been to ignore it all and take the game way too seriously, thereby ignoring the obvious silliness of where we found ourselves. The lRP thing to do would have been to ignore all of the shipside crew, probably bored out of their minds, waiting for the round to end, desperate to do something fun IC, and focusing entirely on the groundside--as you, for some reason, seem to think is a CO's job.

    It isn't.

    Maybe you think doing anything but treating 2d spessman as the hardcore serious milsim game it isn't is "low RP." That's fine. You are entitled to that boring opinion. I welcome you to apply to apply for CO; you will run a ship where all of the marines hate you, you still won't win rounds, and no latejoin CO will ever ruin your day. Until you do that, feel free to flame me on Discord. But filing a report so full of misinformation and so obviously ill-thought out and edited is taking it too far.

    Still, thanks for giving me something fun to write tonight. I hope you have as much fun replying to it as I did writing it!

  5. #5
    Developer & CO Senator (Major General) naut's Avatar
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    CO Council is investigating this issue right now.
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    I'm just someone trying her hardest to not get everyone horribly killed.

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  6. #6
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    I'm just gonna copy paste it because I do not know how to quote specific things on this.

    "Tablet and shipside announcements do not share a CD with the central console. This is literally a lie. Your own screenshot shows me not using the central console for my sillier announcements. Furthermore, you are absolutely delusional if you think marines would have somehow clinched a victory from an obviously lost round because of your one big time flank announcement---in a dead-end siege, no less--and it was DEFINITELY THE LATEJOIN CO'S FAULT THAT WE LOST GUYS. You are aware that you still have squad comms, right?"

    Just to talk about the dead end siege argument. We didn't really even move into bar before getting attacked and pushed back to fob by the 12:30-ish mark. From then we sat in fob until 12:45-ish, and slowly pushed to just south east of medical after some lucky xeno kills. I dont think CO was awake at this time, however the XO actually cryo'd. And it was only SO's, and I think armenis was in req for a bit? I don't know the specifics of that. But he was at least telling delta (my squad) and I assume the other squads that if they needed anything to ask him, probably every 5-10 minutes. After XO cryo'd (they were giving out orders on announcements) CO comes in, when our frontline at south east medical buckles and slowly folds. Then we get stuck into defending fob for another 20 minutes, then we lose.


    "And anyway, if I really was inactive in command, which I wasn't in any meaningful sense, you should actually be happy--more room for you to lead us to victory, as you had been the entire round. If this premise is true, I don't see what you have to be upset about. I couldn't possibly have gotten in your way enough for my inaction to matter."

    and

    "Maybe you think doing anything but treating 2d spessman as the hardcore serious milsim game it isn't is "low RP." That's fine. You are entitled to that boring opinion. I welcome you to apply to apply for CO; you will run a ship where all of the marines hate you, you still won't win rounds, and no latejoin CO will ever ruin your day. Until you do that, feel free to flame me on Discord. But filing a report so full of misinformation and so obviously ill-thought out and edited is taking it too far."

    You're essentially saying here is that, 'wow Ceyella, you sure are good. Maybe if you're so great, why don't you WL to become a CO? huh hotshot?'

    We really, really needed a commander, actually. And simply put, you didn't command the groundside. You didn't say a single thing.

  7. #7
    Ceyella
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    I was using message all in squad at the consoles to talk to people due to it giving a audio cue to check chat. We kept SLs constantly up and called out information.

  8. #8
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    Just to talk about the dead end siege argument. We didn't really even move into bar before getting attacked and pushed back to fob by the 12:30-ish mark. From then we sat in fob until 12:45-ish, and slowly pushed to just south east of medical after some lucky xeno kills. I dont think CO was awake at this time, however the XO actually cryo'd.
    This is all completely irrelevant. Do you know why? Because when I joined, I headed to the CIC and I asked "what happened?" Artemis, who was the only SO actually communicating me, told me we were holding groundside. All of this information you've decided to share with me now was not conveyed. My requests for operational recap were met with discussions about cats. No one actually told me shit about the operation's history.

    Furthermore, I don't know if you're ever been a latejoin aCO--I'm going to guess you haven't--I'd like to point out that it is extremely disorientating. It took me several minutes of watching cams and reading chat just to figure out where we were, who the aSLs were, what the status of the FOB was, what it made sense to spend Req budget on, to make sure that req was doing its job instead of fucking around with cats (which was one of the main reasons WHY I told the RO to bring the cats to the CIC), and whether or not we needed to immediately evacuate.

    After XO cryo'd (they were giving out orders on announcements) CO comes in, when our frontline at south east medical buckles and slowly folds. Then we get stuck into defending fob for another 20 minutes, then we lose.
    By the time I had actually figured out what was happening, I was bogged down with shipside affairs. And by the time I could actually focus on the operation, the situation was obviously hopeless. This, incidentally, is why I didn't order more OBs--the last OB had just been fired and there was no chance in all of the world that we were going to hold groundside for another 5 Byond minutes while it was reloaded and rechambered, especially when all of our engineers were busy running around with cats.

    You're essentially saying here is that, 'wow Ceyella, you sure are good. Maybe if you're so great, why don't you WL to become a CO? huh hotshot?'
    Actually what I'm essentially saying here is that it's fine to be salty because you think the CO is bad. Every marine loss is blamed on command, and almost never deservedly. I'm used to it. But filing a report because you're salty marines lost takes it to another level.

    We really, really needed a commander, actually. And simply put, you didn't command the groundside. You didn't say a single thing.
    You and Ceyella both seem to be operating with this as your central premise. Simply put, it isn't true. I had several conversations with Artemis and was in active discussion with the Normandy's PO over whether or not we should evacuate. In fact it was Meer who I hardly had any communication with and who didn't tell me anything about what was happening groundside--and who I barely noticed talking in squad comms. I was watching comms and made console announcements reporting the queen's location based on squad chat intelligence. I even ran down to the Normandy to give its PO my tac binocs because he asked for them over command. Did I do much more than that? Honestly I don't remember, because this was one round out of hundreds I've played as CO. Maybe I could have said more on Delta chat. Maybe that would have made all the difference!

    That wasn't my reading of the situation at the time.

    I appreciate that, to you, playing an SL, probably not even reading chat half of the time, it felt like the commander wasn't doing anything. It often feels that way. But that isn't what happened. I was doing as much as I could while engaging with the crew and actively roleplaying.

    We really, really needed a commander, actually. And simply put, you didn't command the groundside. You didn't say a single thing.
    Once again, this just isn't true. But even if you were correct, I would hope that you might be able to empathize with how extremely challenging of a position I was put in as a (very) latejoin captain trying to run the CIC and juggle ten thousand things on the ship.

    And since I have your attention, I'd like to reiterate that the role of the CO is not to win rounds. It is to ensure rounds are fun and people are roleplaying. Maybe more importantly, in my opinion, it's to avoid OOC metagaming at all costs. For example, if I had wanted a shot at winning this round, I would have immediately ordered a full evacuation upon waking up--because it was clear to me, as a very experienced player, we weren't going to win groundside--and demanded ultra-fortifications at briefing. That would be the big brained meta strat. I didn't do this. Do you know why? Because marines like FOB sieges. They like fighting on the ground. SLs like making their own decisions, and 99% of the time they won't listen to their CO anyway.

    You seem to be forgetting that the purpose of CM13 is for the players to enjoy themselves, not for marines to win. Marines are supposed to lose the majority of their rounds. Marine losses are more fun for the average player than marine victories, because rounds go on for longer and involve more combat.

    That isn't to say that I deliberately throw rounds, because I absolutely don't, but that this extreme fixation over the fact that marines lost is totally absurd. So what? Who cares? Everything you're saying here just makes me think you're upset that you lost. Get over it. It's a game. Victory or defeat means nothing more than what song plays when the round ends.

    I utterly reject your premise that anything I did--or didn't do--led to our defeat. The round was lost by the time I joined. But do you know what? Even if it was my fault, somehow, it doesn't matter. Being bad is not against the rules. This conversation is completely, utterly irrelevant. I made a number of decisions, using my best judgement at the time. Maybe you think my decisions were wrong. Maybe you're even right! It still doesn't matter.

  9. #9
    Ceyella
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    I didn’t file this report because we lost and I’m salty.

    It’s filed because I feel you broke WL by your actions to be LRP about cats and screw off

    Many CO got taken down for this kind of thing so I believe it’s against WL

  10. #10
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    It’s filed because I feel you broke WL by your actions to be LRP about cats and screw off
    It's hard for me to take this seriously when nearly everything you've said about my being "LRP about cats and screw off" isn't true and isn't what happened in the actual round. You'll forgive me for not believing your statement of intentions here.

    As a final, final, final point to this completely pointless discussion, if incorporation the cats into our shipside roleplay in an extremely minor way is worthy of literally being jobbaned for something I've been screened for and pre-approved, if acknowledging this reality is inherently low RP and this is a high RP server (lol), the cats shouldn't have been spawned in the first place. I did not make this up as a joke coming into the round. I did not grab Jones and demand people worship him. I used what was already there in the round, which was obviously not realistic for a military vessel in the 23rd century in the first place, and used it to engage shipside crew. I find it very alarming that you cannot appreciate this.

    Any moderators checking the logs will see that most of what I did with the cats in this round was actually just saying "okay" to ideas shipside crew put forward, with the exception of the catcommendations. Saying "yes" is the first rule of improv and one of the most important concepts in good roleplaying. You are utterly failing to convince me that what I did was "low RP" in any sense.

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