HeartlessArtless - Commanding Officer Application

[AlbertBlackwell]

Uhmmmmm. This application has me very conflicted, there is absolutely no doubt that your a good SL/Commander.


But


Your will spend rounds where MPs have messed up and arrested a ton of marines for a variety of charges, people around you are telling you that they're false etc etc anyone and anything will try to appeal to you for a pardon. Your going to have to know marine law if you like it or not. The CO is literally above the CMP when it comes to law enforcement and you can't just ignore the issues.


Voting -1 until I see some CMP/MP/MW rounds.

[Survivor]

I typically don't make comments on apps anymore, but I've chosen to make an exception here. Let me preface this, I've been playing CM since late 2016, early 2017, and have had the CO Whitelist since mid 2018. In addition, I was elected on the first, second, and third terms of the CO Council, when councils were initially formed. I believe most players who have interacted with me in game can vouch that I am not a shitty CO, and that I do my job in all aspects appropriately while playing the role. With that out of the way, let me state a fact.

You do not need to play MP to be a good CO. I've played maybe 6 rounds as an MP, and 1 round as a CMP ever. Yet, I know marine law in and out like the back of my hand. Why? Because you have to be a brainless ape to not grasp even the complicated concepts of marine law. Stating that playing MP is "necessary" to be a good CO is absolutely false. The CO is the head of marine law, but if they are doing their job, they almost never even have to directly bother with it. You don't need to go make arrests, you don't need to watch prisoners, or hunt down fugitives. Guess what? Thats why the MPs exist. Even when you do have to get involved, such as executions, and you don't remember the main procedure, guess what? Control F, "Execution" on the marine law document. The funny thing is, the main parts the CO needs to know about marine law are exclusive to the CO role itself, such as BEs and pardons. You literally don't need a single round as an MP to be a good CO, yet people here are making it seem like its the end of the world if you haven't played MP. I'd go as far as to say, MP is probably the least required role to know in order to be a good CO. SO, SL, and PFC are the most important in terms of assisting the actual operation. Knowing Medical, requisitions and engineering is useful for making sure the operation is running properly. Hell, even dropship knowledge is more important than knowing how to play MP. Its mindblowing how people can't accept that marine law is simply readable, and doesn't take 100 hours of MP to comprehend.

Obviously I'm dropping my +1. I've interacted with Satomi. We barely ever communicated, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to tell that they know their shit, and im sure they have enough brain cells and are literate enough to simply read the marine law document.

[DriedMilk]

You do not need to play MP at all in order to play CO properly. I've played this game since 2016 and had my CO app approved in early 2018 and I can say for myself that situations where you're required to touch MP matters at all are wide and rare-- even then, you can quickly skim through the wiki to find out a solution to the matter, which is not hard considering ctrl + F exists. I basically never touch WL apps to vote, so consider this probably one of the few times that I'm doing this lmao. Anyways, the player in question can roleplay and is mechanically aware, which are the requirements to be approved as CO.

+1

[Casada_Radio]

There really a lot of weird and awkward things in this app especially with the people commenting it, so I am gonna point out the things and many issues I have with the really warped mindset that seems to seep into most of you. But before I go there, I wanna start with Tater's comment first to clear some things:

1. Personally attacking someone in an app who has not attacked you in the app is uncalled for and is a sign of unprofessionalism. On what basis do you say that there is an agenda to make CM LRP? I can claim that there is socialist takeover of CM by the CCP in order to perpetuate communist propaganda on the masses of CM, and CM is a product of modern socialist perversion. Does that make my claim valid?(I could say the P word but I am not here to stir and we should move on).

2. This statement about agenda and CCM and many rumour associated about it is really dumb and seems to imply that there is a tendency to divide the community. Like this one rumour we are somehow going to get your old devs and dev team over when really we only got 2 devs working on it. I ask that you treat CCM different.

3. Any remarks to CCM is uncalled for when the App was made in CM and is therefore in the context of CM.

4. Some of the supportive people, like myself, are here rooting for Satomi who we consider as our friend. Making friends is not an unnatural process when humans possess a basic form of social skill and need. Social skill and need is evidence of a good CO as it shows that they are socially capable of dealing with people and not some narcissist or anti-social who is biased and secluded from the needs of his friends and buds, which can includes the players. The failure to understand this simple process is a troubling sign.

Now after that was cleared up, back to the App
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So to simplify the issues and how I address them, these are the issues I will be addressing:
1. CO requiring MP experience
2. Misconception that following MP or the law is a form of good RP
3. CO has final authority on the law (AAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA)

So firstly, CO do not require MP experience only a thorough understanding of Marine Law and SOP. Playing MP has 0 guarantee that you understand Marine Law. Many applications of Marine Law are carried out in SOPs clearly stated in the wiki and is therefore hard to miss. Marine Law as it is is a check on whether it is fulfilled or not, with a lack of written legal theory and principle save for The Rule of Law, and the lack of Case Laws which our player report defines its actual application. Even so, such interpretation is flawed because of clown things like this report: //showthrea...-CO-guidelines

What's wrong with the report? Simple:

1. That somehow the flash button in the room which is used to subdue marines in the briefing from shenanigans to install ORDER before a brief is implied as assault
2. No physical assault has taken place, neither was there physical trespass.
3. A dev feature added in has a restrictive measure in place for the very purpose it was built, which makes the law in of itself redundant and LRP
4. Most importantly, the law is not interpreted by its meaning, it is interpreted by those who enforce it. It always has, and always will be like this. Look no further from how our rules are enforced and you can see this similarity. I can go indepth the legal argument for this but we are talking about a CO app not law. And this is a reflective problem of ML

(Understand that I am not criticising nor aiming to criticise staff but merely stating past events.)

As I understand, the underlying principle of why you guys are asking for MP experience is so that the CO can witness how Marine Law is applied. Let's assume I agree with you for a minute, that they do need MP experience. This, will bring up many questions to which it ensures consistency in the CO's ability to follow Marine Law:

1. The Marine Law is interpreted plain and simple, and so is application
2. To suggest otherwise would mean you need legal backing in principle and case studies along with legal theories on how its applied. Are you going to tell me that Marine Law is based on the English Common Law?(Good luck, the course takes 3 years for an LLB) There is none, and to ask Staff to consolidate such is also implausible and not feasible as it is a free to play 2D spessman game. Have you guys ever tried to buy a LAW BOOK? Do you have any idea how much it COSTS and how much time does it take to COMPILE ONE? As such, no legal nor spirit of the law exist except its RP and Rule of Law and fun. You are not enrolling COs to ML Law School and not everyone is free as you.

This is not a Synthetic App and we should not treat it as a Synth App, this is a CO app that requires the attention of all departments. They dont even know the full inworks of Engineering and Medical, they just understand enough to ensure it runs and LEAD. MPs are welcome to advise on legal issues and usually it is because there is a less of investigative discipline or philosophy in CO and MPs more than the actual understanding of the Law, and how to juggle chaotic situation. MPs have this huge misconception that the CO is free to do everything. He has to ensure everything from Ship, OB, CAS, Medical, Ground, EVERYTHING runs. Law is important, but it does not take no 1 priority in majority of the situations. What takes priority and urgency depends on the crisis and situation the CO is in and such things are dynamic and unpredictable.

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Next is the Misconception that following Marine Law or MP is some form of good RP. It is a method of RP, nothing else. How many doctors and engineers do you see talking nerd stuff about chemistry indepth with advanced metallurgy, engineering, thermal engineering, etc. Before you go to me how these require technical and professional knowledge, I would like to remind everyone that Law is a professional qualification that requires indepth technical knowledge of its own. To suggest otherwise is a profanity to the law and complete misunderstanding, disregard of its importance, ignorance whether wilfull or not, and a complete disrespect of the subject and those who practice it.

It is a route to RP, nothing more. And somehow you guys think it is good RP to know the law. Have you ever read an actual case law or watched legal debates and arguments? This is intellectualism, not RP. You going into nerd stuffs which we PAY lawyers for. You dont force Synths to know Engineering and Medical indepth why force COs to know the law in such degree? What is the rule? RP, have fun, dont ruin the rounds.

If you like reading case laws I can give you some examples:

Note this is without me sharing the Legal Theories and Principles established in the English Common Law and the English Legal System.

It is a method of RP, nothing more. And said method is provided in the Wiki. CO leads and commands and requires the corporation of the MPs. And MPs who fail such ML conduct he can ahelp the situation to the staff. It is the duty of the MP to follow ML and SOP, and for the CO to follow WL rules. Anything he needs to know about ML is clearly written in the wiki. Any clarification he has can be clarified by ahelp. Breaking of ahelp advice or order by staff is the responsibility of the CO to bear the consequences from the staff.

In fact, the lack of cooperative standards from the MP department to CIC and the rest is concerning and some MP players showing arrogance towards their role and importance of their role. Such as? A certain named individual bragging in a report that they followed the rule to a T, before being banned for a rulebreak.(I will not state who). This lack of cooperative standard is why people dislike the MPs.

The CO is a commander, a leader, not the synthetic. We have a specific role for that. If MP players care that much about how a CO behaves in accordance to the law, they can be friendly about it and advice and understand the situation of the CO. The CO is trained to lead men into combat to victory. He can in his spare time review the articles of the law if he wishes to. MPs work as a team with the whole ship, and they should behave as such. If you want CO to help you with something, do your reporting properly and be cooperative about it.

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CO has final authority on the Law....AAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

In Theory yes but in practice no. Why? They get either get screwed by MPs or they get screwed by Staff. They are not MPs so they do not have time to thoroughly investigate situations. Since MPs do, it is onus on them to prove the crime of the wrongdoer with evidence. Lack of evidence thereoff is negligence on part of the MP. Because of this, MPs are controllers of information and can abuse this to their advantage against the CO who is busy leading/setting up/prepping for an operation. Those with the proper information are in control, and the MPs have such control. How many COs do you see get screwed? Mostly by MPs not being thorough in investigating or by giving biased report.

This is why it is not really practical. You guys are asking the impossible from the CO. Again, this is not a Synthetic role. Onus is on you to proof the wrong. Onus is also on you to call High Command to take care of the situation when needed. Realistic situation in the real world when people are in power or in management, they care little about the back law and focus on the crisis at hand. They win first and do the law later. And this is HRP and from a guy with some degree of legal background but have a group of friends with legal background and profession. This is as realistic as you can get. Why else do you need lawyers to argue your way out and/or advise you the steps?

Currently, and hopefully and by that I have high hopes on staff, things may set right with ML and MP players.

Nonetheless, based on the above 3 main points, it is unrealistic, unfeasible, LRP and impractical to impose such requirement on a CO. ML RP is not the only RP and it is a route to RP. Satomi gets my +1

Before you diss me about who I am and all, let me say.

I am

THE LAW!

I play as Rufus 'Law' Stallone

And the law is just, it is pure, clear, non-ambiguous, fair, reasonable. It serves justice to those under the law. It maintains order and keeps it from falling into anarchy. We who serve the law upholds her in the highest regard and honors her as she is. It aims to protect society from falling apart and individuals from individuals. It establishes freedom, yet with careful guidance, of those who wrote the law. No scum of the earth is above the law and no angelic individual can pervert it. It is for those to follow and protect those under it. It must exist, and its existence must come with enforcement.

Why?

Because

[GhostGhost360]

Do you need to play 1min of MP to understand ML? No you don’t, it just helps since you will run into more examples of how ML is applied. You could spend 45min reading SOP/ML and ask a couple questions to someone that knows what they are talking about and have enough knowledge to be CO.
This is the sad reality though, at this point it doesn’t really matter what you say in your app or how many people support you. Obviously, the council can do anything but this is just what I imagine is the most likely outcome to be is. You’ll need to read ML like I said but also play some MP so that people don’t have an excuse to -1 for ‘’not talking criticism seriously from last app’’. This is the stupid pageantry of the WL that you can’t really avoid. Id suggest just withdrawing and applying again, next time people will post a bunch of questions to ‘’test you’’. Its stupid that you can’t just be given the benefit of the doubt that you’ll re-read ML/SOP before playing CO given your status in the community. Maybe this will change how apps are reviewed in future to allow for a greater emphasis on the member of the community over specific answers.

Best of luck Uno, I have complete faith you would be a good CO if you got accepted today.

[Arbs]

People this is a CO whitelist application, not a CMP application. I think you're getting a lot of confusion. We're here to place judgement on a leader, not a marine law expert.

As a player who has been around for a few years with two council terms behind my back, I will say that some of the most amazing COs we've ever had, were never MP mains, nor MP experts.

What you people are doing here is ignoring the potential and the talent of this player, who as a matter of fact is one of the few names that I recognize over the years for good reasons, just because of a lack of MP hours.


The job of a commanding officer is to lead. That means to make the hard decisions, maintain cohesion and pace, and bring security and confidence to every marines in regards to the structure and command of the unit they lead. The Commanding officer is not supposed to be a marine law lawyer, nor direct law enforcement. As clearly as they stated it in the application, they're here to make sure things fall in line, first in the ground operations and then as well as every department shipside.


You have to remember that every ship department has a head of department in it and is also capable of operating independently. As a commanding officer you are expected to -delegate- tasks and information through these department heads. Direct intervention should be reserved for extreme or immediately urgent cases. Similarly the MP department can operate independently to carry their duties as well as with the CMP as a head of that department. Shall the need arise to make an intervention, consulting with the CMP or when none is available the MP team directly and using that input to make a decision with reference to the easily accessible marine law (two clicks on the wiki), will prove to be no challenge for the player in question. I for a fact know that they are intelligent and competent enough to handle it. You need to be brainless not to be able to comprehend even the more "complex" parts of marine law.

Again important to note here is to be well aware of your provisions in the form of server rules, SOP and marine law. Which I believe you already are for the most part, but never forget that those wiki links will prove extremely helpful to keep on the back of your mind and on the side. Anything you're doubtful on, check it and reference it to those pages. It's very basic and I believe you will have no issue with such.


With that out of the way, I would much rather focus on the personal abilities and capabilities of this player.

HeartlessArtless, or as I liked to remember by the nickname we gave you "Satomi Uno", from what I've seen from your performance and conduct in-game, mostly as an SL and also on often enough on command roles, has always been more than satisfactory.

It is rare especially nowadays to see competent SL players and frankly you do remind me of exceptional squad leaders like Park-So-Hee. You're capable enough to handle yourself skills-wise, which I do not question, but more important you can yell orders. And that is something that makes for good commanders, getting your orders through. On top of that from a more command point of view, you can connect the dots from a situation and formulate a plan on that.

The consideration you have given to scenarios and your careful approach will also prove very beneficial to you in the long term, as with more experience you will face no issues with such.

From what I can see is that, we're at a point where everything is being looked at very technically and this in turn has resulted in very mediocre and uninteresting COs that polishing their imaginative fluff RP and items. What we need is CO players that can deliver a true contribution to the round, get things done and overall bring a sense of belonging to every marine player in the round.

If you have been able to handle aCO as XO before and -especially- as SO, then I believe you to potentially be a very good candidate for the CO role.

That being said I wish you all the best of luck with the application and I encourage the CO council and anyone who will pass a judgement to this application to give consideration at your potential as I explained above.

It would be a shame and extremely regretful, if not a sin, to turn down someone with the capability and talent to be a good CO player, just because of a technicality on lack of MP playtime, which is not as relevant to the CO role as most would think.

Do us proud and good luck. You have my full support and confidence.

+1

[Nanu308]

I don't normally comment on Applications if ever or take a look at them, but there seems to be a lot of misinformation regarding CO's and marine law.

This is what i think, a CO should know their three most important Captain provisions which are:

1. Battlefield Executions
2. Pardons
3. Ability to change SOP


The Captain is the highest ranking when it comes to Marine Law, this is true, but they are not the CMP set to handle the MP department during the round and neither should they be required to have perfect knowledge of it as they in 99% of all cases do not need to interfere in Marine Law matters.

The CO whitelist is not a CMP application,
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Now please, continue the arguing, it's fun to read

[optimisticdude]

Maybe Triiodine was right about the state of the CO WL and its future.

+1, you're a good candidate.

[BurnedSweetPotato]

active, competent and reliable in the roles you play, not a shitter - all you should need to be accepted. simple as. +1

[Fortelian]

You have a tidal wave of support, and people saying you'll contribute to the round in many positive ways. That cannot be ignored. Your answers however, were not perfect. Tater went over them well, and you'd do good to take his advice. I'm willing to support this, but I do hope you've listened and learned from what everyone has said here (Some people writing essays).

Now, playing MP and understanding marine law is very important, but I think what matters here is the fact that you sound like a fun commander. I haven't been able to observe you yet, but I'll trust what others have said here.

Do know that playing as the captain, you WILL encounter scenarios were you are gonna be hoping you know marine law, I can tell you that. If you ever need clarification on any law or SOP or anything, you can ahelp, ask in #staff-help, anything like that. You do need a good grasp of marine law, that's for sure, but if you are willing to review it case by case and you listen to people, I'm sure you'll do just fine.

Of course I'm going to get flak for asking you 10 questions then supporting you but I don't care. Just remember to always get clarification if you need it. And I know people say "Dura lex, sed lex" but I say to you, the law is swift, but justice is patient. Well, not much else to put here. Godspeed captain.

P.S

ONE last thing, about the SEA, I know you aren't a mentor so I'm not faulting you for this, but it's best to just let the SEA do their own thing. You answered it the best I could reasonably expect a non SEA-Scholar to do so, so that's all good.