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Thread: Drevenshekel - SOP ; CO WL Expectations

  1. #1
    Whitelisted Captain LilPenpusher's Avatar
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    Drevenshekel - SOP ; CO WL Expectations

    Player Report
    Your Byond ID?
    LilPenpusher

    Date of Incident
    July 20, 2021

    Your Character Name?
    Misti Rockwell

    Accused Byond Key(if known):
    Drevenshekel

    Accused Character Name
    Wamakahana Windhealer

    Approximate time and date of the incident (Central US Time for fastest results)
    ~2PM Central US Time

    What rule(s) were broken:
    SOP ; CO WL Expectations

    Description of the incident:
    I was CMP in a round with Windhealer CO today. Everything proceeded as those rounds usually do: Windhealer wanted to deploy, he asked for Honour guards, everything was chill.

    I then *overheard* (i.e. was NOT explicitly informed in any way) that Armouries in CiC were being used to equip 3-4 random PFCs to act as Honour Guards, eventhough I already had one MP delegated to that task.

    Windhealer proceeded to equip the PFCs with not only SO Armour, but Tac Shotties, as well.

    I eventually came into CiC and confronted Dreven about this, with two MPs as backup. I informed him that he cannot issue Armoury gear to non-officers without an emergency/pressing reason to do so. He proceeded to tell me to 'not be a stickler', before typing out a hasty announcement that "SOP is hereby changed and I can give out gear to PFCs". I forgot what exactly the announce said, but it was announced AFTER the deed. Of course, this ignores that you CANNOT change SOP in this case, because it's a non-modifiable part of SOP.

    CO told me to stand down and bugger off, and so I bit my tongue and decided not to pester the PFCs about returning the illegal gear they were wearing to cause friction in CiC so early.

    I went to fax HC, which took the entire round (until evac) to receive a reply. As I left and wrote my fax, I overheard Dreven telling me to "not be a skitler" and not bother to fax.

    After evac, an arrest order for Windhealer came, on grounds of NoD and FtFP. I was unable to fullfill this arrest warrant due to Marines coming to protect Windhealer, and because of Hijack.



    While I'm aware that the HC response via fax technically makes this sort of an IC issue, I'm primarily worried because a CO should not be making these types of slip-ups. Dreven is a player who, despite being a popular CO, is renown for having a relatively poor grasp of ML and SOP, and keeps messing up with them. This, to me, is not acceptable for a whitelisted CO, especially given how many times in the past this kind of report has been leveled against him already.

    Evidence (screenshots, logs, etc):
    Sadly I didn't take a screencap of the HC arrest order, or have any caps of the announcement for SOP change. I'd need logs pulled.

    How you would punish the accused:
    At the very least a Warning by the CO Council.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Dreven's Avatar
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    I didn't hand out tac shotguns, thats a lie, infact Im pretty sure I explicity said No tac shotguns. Any reasonable CMP would just remind me about SOP then allow me to change it, you made a point of having to arrest me roundstart which woulda been a major disruption of the round, over a minor technicality.

    Your only making a report on me because you didn't get to arrest me IC, taking an IC issue to OOC.
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  3. #3
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    Was the XO During this round, i was watching the whole thing and I didn't see any tac shotguns taken by the two marines, only a deploying SO and a MP honor guard. remember the announcement even stating no tac shotguns
    My Medals

  4. #4
    Senior Member Dreven's Avatar
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    Yeah thankyou, SOP was broken for no more than 5 seconds, you wanted to disrupt the entire round being a rule lawyer to arrest me over this. All because I was providing a fun opportunity for some PFC's to get some cool armor and play as my bodyguards. I completely accept it playing out IC, but you just had to take it to an OOC report right after because you didn't get to. Admins even approved me resisting IC, which is all I did, I didn't cause any riot or tell marines to attack MPs. I simply said MP's were attempting to arrest me, and called for loyal men to surround me in medbay, while the XO locked down CIC, all RP'd.

    Logs will show that I mentioned HG's will not be given tac shotguns, the CMP knows this, I dunno why you would try to put that in your report to make this look alot worse
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  5. #5
    Whitelisted Captain LilPenpusher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreven View Post
    I didn't hand out tac shotguns, thats a lie, infact Im pretty sure I explicity said No tac shotguns.
    We found a Tac Shotty north of CiC just after the incident, meaning you must not have been watching them + somebody (you or XO) must have opened the lockers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreven View Post
    Any reasonable CMP would just remind me about SOP then allow me to change it
    But you CAN'T change it, Dreven. You are literally demonstrating to us in live action why I'm filing this report: because you STILL don't understand SOP or ML correctly. Armoury gear is non-modifiable SOP, which as a CO you are EXPECTED to understand and follow. Your change of SOP is irrelevant because it can't legally be changed at all.

    Since your law change is not valid, the law remains that:

    1. Special equipment found in armories such as Mk221s is not allowed to be handed out to non-officers without a clear, understandable, and urgent reason behind doing so.
    2. One may not send items stored in the Armory as part of a supply drop, give them away as rewards/prizes, or form a squad that uses such equipment as standard.

    You had neither a pressing, urgent reason to give the PFCs any sort of Armoury equipment, not even the Armour, but you also gave it to them as basically standard-issue equipment because this was Pre-First drop and you had them deploy as Honour Guards. This obviously ignores the fact that Honour Guards HAVE to be MPs to count as actual Honour Guards, and that you may only have TWO of them escorting you at maximum. You had one MP, Seraphine Decarte, deploying as HG already. You called 4 PFCs up to also escort you. If your reason to give them illegal, armoury gear is "I needed them to have the best gear possible as my bodyguards" then that reason is not only non-urgent, it's also illegal on account of them being too many and not being MPs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreven View Post
    you made a point of having to arrest me roundstart which woulda been a major disruption of the round, over a minor technicality.
    This is a incredibly silly argument. You broke the Law. I faxed HC, as is expected of me as CMP, to report your transgressions to HC. For the record, I actually did NOT fax to "have CO arrested". I actually faxed HC and asked them to send an Investigator, and have you demoted. I never asked HC to let me arrest you, but they told me to after evac anyway, because there was no time for an Investigator at that point.

    Anywho, the "it's a major round disruption so you can't do it" is a retarded argument to make. That sort of argument works for Predators because they're not meant to kill high-influence roles that can tip the course of a round. It doesn't count for MPs. Why would it?

    If this is how you genuinely think about what MPs should do, then your understanding of the MPs as a role and department, and ML in general, is even more lacking than I thought.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreven View Post
    Your only making a report on me because you didn't get to arrest me IC, taking an IC issue to OOC.
    I deliberately did NOT try to arrest you despite the order when I ran into you in Medbay, actually. You did the smart play and rallied people to your side.

    Could I have arrested you anyway? 100%, yes. I could have told MPs to simply flashbang the fuck out of Medical while I cuff and fireman carry you away. But that would have left every Marine steaming mad at us, and have a Mutiny issued against us to free you.

    I had an order to arrest you, but I am also a sentient being and a superior to my MPs. If we went for the arrest, we all would have gotten hanged by the Marines. I went with protecting my subordinates over blindly going through with an arrest order. Instead, I talked with you for 5 minutes until Hijack finally started. I was delaying to not appear as though I was ignoring an arrest order, contrary to how you believe I was simply too stupid to arrest you.
    Lance Corporal Misti Rockwell, Squad Medic (Alpha/Bravo).

    Synthetic Unit 'Amber'.


    Captain Misti Rockwell, USS Yokosuka, 2nd Division, 2nd Battlegroup, 3rd Fleet.


  6. #6
    Senior Member Dreven's Avatar
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    Yes, making an IC arrest over uniforms and armor and then taking that to an OOC report is a completely reasonable thing to do. The Honor Guard in this case was purely just aesthetics, the officer armor is not more powerful at all over marine armor and you need the uniforms to wear the armor, which you can also get from various other vendors around so its really a non issue. Complete IC that your taking to OOC
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  7. #7
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    I was MP that round here is my perspective and a timeline of what happened.

    Round start windhealer request Honor guard consisting of 3pvts & 1 medic. Not long after windhealer after having his team authorizes the use of SO, XO, and CO armories to the crew to ger up for honor guard duty limiting the use of tactical shotties. Announcement is made about the changes in SOP to authorize this. This is where the first problem happens.

    "Special equipment found in armories such as Mk221s is not allowed to be handed out to non-officers without a clear, understandable, and urgent reason behind doing so. The M46C currently stored in the armory, can only be handed out to a Staff officer(SO) or an Executive Officer (XO), it is not to be handed out to anyone else."

    Misti rockwell (CMP) informs windhealer of the problem that has just occurred. In addition Misti informs windhealer that any SOP changes must be told ahead of time to MPs to avoid confusion later down the line. Discussion is had about the break-in unchangeable SOP and operation begins with CO and crew deploying. CO gives threat on mp coms about making the shift much harder for the mps should they procced with anything regarding him and ML enforcment.

    "Military Police must be informed of any changes made to the SOP before its implemented."

    Round goes its course with marines losing. By that point Misti had faxed HC about the issue. Misti gets a fax from HC authorizing the arrest of CPT windhealer. Once word gets out Windhealer makes announcement calling marines whom are loyal to him to come defend him from the MPs whom he framed to be trying to "coup" the good captain.

    The announcement goes along the lines of " good ungas rally to me .... mps ... coup". Full citation is needed as i forgot to screenshot that part.

    Mps are informed of fax we go to medbay and see this

    MPs are ordered to medbay by Misti to arrest CO.

    windhealer_01.jpg

    Then begins a shouting match between mps and CO. There was alot of confusion between MPs and XO regarding CO telling marines that MPs are trying to mutiny. CO refuses to be arrested despite HC orders.

    Orders XO to secure CIC from MPs.

    Windhealer makes an announcement for MPs to stand down and not arrest him against the wishes of HC.

    windhealer_02.jpg

    This would be an illegal order as CO and MPs are bound by ML to enforce it. Not doing so would be neglect of duty and worse especially since it came from high command.

    LOOC conversation is had with windhealer asking misti if she plans to make a player report if he continues what he is doing.

    They continue shouting until ship hijack.

    Windhealer makes an announcement saying if MPs attempt to arrest him during hijack he will BE MPs as MPs posed a "risk" to him.


    windhealer_03.jpg


    Regarding ML violations


    Illegal order to not arrest CO despite HC wishes.

    Giving out armory gear without extreme reason to do so like ship hijack.

    Illegally modifying and unmodifiable section of SOP

    Failure to inform MPs about SOP changes prior to implementing it.

    Ordering Marines to rally to him to prevent his arrest which would be interference with the enforcement of ML.
    Last edited by TheFlyingFlail; 07-20-2021 at 10:15 PM.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Dreven's Avatar
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    ML is not OOC rules at all, your really this mad because I let some PFC players get to do something different by playing as honor guards with some snowflakey armor. No tac shotguns were handed out, if someone stole some later on that has nothing to do with this, and really is a failure on your part as MP's to keep security.

    The admins said I was allowed to resist the arrest IC, which is what I did, its not a break of the rules, and the fact that you are only reporting this after failing to get the IC conclusion you wanted is really telling of poor-form.
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  9. #9
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    Per the SOP rules it covers all gear from the armory. Even if you did exclude tactical shotguns it would follow under your responsibility since you authorized the use of armory gear.


    Special equipment found in armories such as Mk221s is not allowed to be handed out to non-officers without a clear, understandable, and urgent reason behind doing so. The M46C currently stored in the armory, can only be handed out to a Staff officer(SO) or an Executive Officer (XO), it is not to be handed out to anyone else. Only CIC Staff may use armory weapons.

    The only clause that says you can is the one where an exceptional reason for giving them out. Deployment doesn't constitute an exceptional reason which is where the problem first occurred in the round.

    Armory equipment may be handed out to all personnel during boarding or a Code Red or Delta scenario. Officers should be prioritized before enlisted.


    Per the honor guard from what I'm aware of only MPs may become Honor Guard. Normal marines are not per the reason that you could simply order them to follow you per chain of command.

    The Captain can request up to two MP’s to escort him planetside, no more may participate.



    Anyone can resist arrest but the issue was you involved everyone else to prevent your arrest orders from HC to take place which would be an illegal order on your part as it would be interference with the enforcement of marine law. It would also be a blow to ML as a whole if you are able to curtail it as such on a regular basis as theoretically and CO can do what you did and face no punishment. If you are going to resist arrest do it on your own. If you incapable of doing so then don't attempt it at all.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Dreven's Avatar
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    I'll cop the warning then but how does me handing out SO Uniform and Armor so some marines can have some voluntary rp fun negatively effect you to the point where a report needs to be dropped, when the situation was already dealt with IC. This is such a ridiculously petty report for something that did nothing negative to the round at all.
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