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Thread: Unknown - Rule 11

  1. #1
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    Unknown - Rule 11

    Player Report
    Your Byond ID?
    Rem1

    Date of Incident
    August 8, 2021

    Your Character Name?
    Daniel Jimenez

    Accused Byond Key(if known):
    Unknown

    Accused Character Name
    LT. Willy Boyer

    Approximate time and date of the incident (Central US Time for fastest results)
    7:00 PM to 7:50 PM GMT+1 (Paris)

    What rule(s) were broken:
    Rule 11

    Description of the incident:
    MW = LT. Willy Boyer
    I was arrested for trying to break out dominic powers, then shooting brett dead when he tried to to taser me.
    Then, the MW, grabs me and arrests me, then brings me into the CMPs office, does a little speech about how "Brett was his favourite CMP" then batons me in custody.
    Ok, thats RP, no issue.
    then he goes to process me, does so, then the issues start.
    He refuses to give me shoes, saying I don't deserve them, and just gives me the prisoner jumpsuit, and also doesn't give a headset, because you don't deserve that.
    after that he tosses me in a perma brig cell. ok yeah that's all good. but then doesn't uncuff me, saying you don't get to be uncuffed, and then when I ask for an appeal, he says "You don't deserve one" and refuses to give me one. he also does some wierd stufff at the end saying I am under oath when I did no oath??
    When I mention the appeal thing to the CMP (Brett) I get told, your appeal rights were suspended.

    Evidence (screenshots, logs, etc):
    I was told logs are being pulled, as the whole round was a mess for Mps and delta, but most of delta can also confirm this if logs are unable to be pulled.

    How you would punish the accused:
    Job ban from all security roles permantly.
    (CMP, MW, MP, and the new MP cadet thing if that gets merged).

  2. #2
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    I should also point out that I didn't lose my headset right as I never had one in the 1st place so how can I do that
    (MW took of my MT headset (I was an MT that round) before his speech about Brett/CMP)

  3. #3
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    Brett McMatherson, CMP, here.

    I did indeed see Jimenez in brig, cuffed to bed near round end. I uncuffed him when I had some spare time. During this round, we have had around four Jailbreaks, at least three MPs were killed, brig was breached from four different directions and, due to above mentioned stuff, I told Jimenez, that his appeal rights were suspended. For context: Jimenez was arrested for Murder for shooting me with six revolver bullets, which brought me into crit, from which I died. I would assign someone to handle his appeal, would I know about it and would brig be fine, Jimenez, however, did not have any headset, so he could not ask for an appeal using his headset.

  4. #4
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    CO from that round here. This is connected to the situation explained in another report here..

    Unfortunately for a majority of the round neither me nor the CMP were free to handle apeals as we were involved in the conflict itself. All this happened in the brig so i didn't see most of it. With all the chaos going on it's hard to spot things like this. I will say that the MW was a bit liberal with the batton but at the same time it was a code RED situation and the CMP was just killed so some leeway is probably expected here.

    I can confirm however that at the end of the round Rem was sitting in perma with the MW rambling about being under oath. The logs would probably show more.

  5. #5
    Senior Administrator and Mentor Overseer
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    Logs posted here are quite specific to the accusation. ALOT was left out, brig was very busy right up until the end. Mostly ive only induced what MW said and very little of everything else, such as the murder or fights or stunnings. In general for a fuller pictures of the conditions of the mp department id suggest you refer to the other PR, if/when it gets logs. If a full picture is considered necessary then i think this report should be merged with the Rals one, but imo they can be handled and ruled as only the underlying situation is common, the accusations of wrongdoing are not. In general what everyone else say seems to add little context as far as the accusations seem cornered. but i will add it if there are parts that anyone thinks are relevant upon request.

    Mod concision regarding in game investigation regarding the ahelp.
    Spoiler Spoiler:



    Jailbreak
    Spoiler Spoiler:


    Rem1 Comms chatter roughly prior to being arrested
    Spoiler Spoiler:


    MW faxing HC about riot situation
    Spoiler Spoiler:



    More comms chatter after they killed the cmp. Probably the basis for denying comms, together with the coms prior.

    Spoiler Spoiler:



    ALL 'INTERACT' interaction logs that exist regarding Daniel for the round.

    Spoiler Spoiler:



    MW Denying the appeal, largely RP focused, in terms of reasons.

    Spoiler Spoiler:



    MW giving an alternative reason for denying appeals, which has a basis in ML. They heavily imply that they will allow a fax appeal, and that them denying it seems to be largely rp, as the amount of rp vs being serious shifts in tone. (they do happen to be the arresting officer too).

    Spoiler Spoiler:



    CMP removing cuffs, this overlaps with MW talking to the prisoners

    Spoiler Spoiler:



    CMP explaining that their appeals rights have been suspended previously.

    Spoiler Spoiler:


    As said at the start there may be things i left out, if you think they need to be induced let me know.
    Trial Moderator: 2021-06-13 --- 2021-07-04
    Moderator: 2021-07-04 --- 2021-10-02
    Investigator: 2021-07-21 --- xxxx-xx-xx
    Trainer: 2021-08-20 --- xxxx-xx-xx
    Discord Staff: 2021-09-20 --- xxxx-xx-xx
    Senior Moderator: 2021-10-02 --- xxxx-xx-xx

  6. #6
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    I would like to clarify one thing: Jimenez demanded release, sincr his appeal was not handled within 30 minutes, and my comment "Your appeal rights were suspended" meant, that he can make appeal to CO right now, however, in past, during jailbreaks, his appeal rights were suspended and thus, we do not have to release him

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    and where in ML does it say those rights can be suspended?

  8. #8
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    and RP focused or not he (the MW) still has to let me appeal as a prisoner, it's written in ML, something that he has to follow no matter what.

  9. #9
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    https://cm-ss13.com/wiki/Marine_Law#Suspending_Appeals

    Suspending Appeals

    Spoiler Spoiler:
    Trial Moderator: 2021-06-13 --- 2021-07-04
    Moderator: 2021-07-04 --- 2021-10-02
    Investigator: 2021-07-21 --- xxxx-xx-xx
    Trainer: 2021-08-20 --- xxxx-xx-xx
    Discord Staff: 2021-09-20 --- xxxx-xx-xx
    Senior Moderator: 2021-10-02 --- xxxx-xx-xx

  10. #10
    Retired Manager Somenerd's Avatar
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    As stated, appeal rights are suspended during riots or jailbreaks, hostile forces approaching the Almayer etc.

    The main thing I can see is that the procedure to deny you a headset was not followed, however there is a statement in there about
    "Prisoners can be denied a radio if a mutiny is ongoing, but only until the mutiny is over.". I've clarified with Nanu and he's confirmed that this also applies to jailbreak, so you can be denied a radio for the duration of the jailbreak, but once it's over you are subject to standard radio allowances.

    Given the situation was severe enough that the CMP was killed, I'd say it's an extreme situation that can result in some messups, and it's not reasonable to expect MP's to deal with appeals while dealing with riots and jailbreaks which are rather urgent situations. It also sounds like as far as uniform goes there wasn't any left to give, which isn't the MP's fault if they've run out of uniforms.

    Report Resolved, Denied.
    Anna "High-Toss" Stall

    I'm a manager now
    I manage moods
    B)

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