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Thread: Let the meta shift.

  1. #1
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    Let the meta shift.

    A LONG LONG TIME AGO IN A PATCH FAR FAR AWAY:
    Marines would land on the planet.
    They would encounter the aliens.
    They would put up a meager push.
    They would get pushed back.
    They would camp at the FOB.
    They would get overrun at the FOB.
    Then they would win or lose on the ship.

    TODAY:
    Marines now have enough resources to build defend-able FOB's.
    Marines now have sniper kits to counter boiler sieges.
    Marines now have flamers to counters lurkers.
    Marines now have medkits for increased suitability in pushes.
    Marines now have improved CAS and will be getting JTAC kits in the future.

    Before you go and nerf the aliens LET THE META SHIFT.

    I played aliens a few days ago and the marines set up a great FOB in the middle of the map.
    Instead of waiting for the marines to move out, Queen ordered it siege'd and we did, many of our T3's were killed, and we still kept trying to break down the FOB. Instead of pulling back and killing the marines out in the open, or flanking, everyone still kept trying to break it down with young T3's. It didn't work. The marines depleted our larva, and then pushed into our hive and killed us all.

    This is exactly how it should be, siegeing the marine FOB while they are at full strength use to work, so that is what you did. Now we actually have to weaken them first, but people have not caught on to that yet. The updates are good, but give them time before you make more changes to the game. That's all I'm trying to say.
    Last edited by Balance Asshat; 02-14-2019 at 01:12 AM.

  2. #2
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    sniper kits are useless

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    "Marines now have sniper kits to counter boiler sieges."

    Best joke ever. Boilers are shining not becouse of acid gass they have inside, but from the mere thought of somebody being 100% sure that this counters them.

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    FOBs are unviable because of mutators, especially boiler gas keystones.
    Sniper kits are a joke and an unintentional marine nerf because they're a points waste.
    Lurker outheals fire and will just drag marines into it then pounce away at lightning speed.
    Medic kit is useful, but not enough to sustain a long push as you still need real medics who get targeted.
    Improved CAS/JTAC still relies on communication, timing and reactions, as well as xenos completely ignoring signal flares or lazes.

    There is no meta shift prompted by any recent change. Best kit is still slug shotgun ir charger/grip/ap rifle because of knockback and unviability of other weapona, best tactic is still to bumrush xenos because of unviability of defences and marines losing power over time while xenos grow.

    This has been the meta for quite some time. If the meta is to change, mutators need fixed to not be straight upgrades, marines need a way to retain power over the long game, and defences need to not be a waste of time.
    Last edited by Chaznoodles; 02-14-2019 at 11:24 AM.

  5. #5
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    we are not going to wait for meta to settle while we can do changes for better, sorry if this is a disappointing answer for you

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    "Marines now have flamers to counters lurkers."

    We had a flame thrower back then. Depends how far back you are talking about. I miss when you could set the Rav on fire.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Madventurer's Avatar
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    IMO the immunities to specific weapons should be changed into heavy resistances instead. Nothing quite like pyro spec being literally useless with area denial against THE Damage T3.

    If the resistance was around 80% for ravagers and fire and perhaps crushers and explosives (not to mention the Queen), they wouldn't be quite so inclined to mindlessly charge and certain weapons wouldn't be completely dogshit, just mostly.
    Tyson 'Bunny' Sphere


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    Quote Originally Posted by Madventurer View Post
    IMO the immunities to specific weapons should be changed into heavy resistances instead. Nothing quite like pyro spec being literally useless with area denial against THE Damage T3.

    If the resistance was around 80% for ravagers and fire and perhaps crushers and explosives (not to mention the Queen), they wouldn't be quite so inclined to mindlessly charge and certain weapons wouldn't be completely dogshit, just mostly.
    80% resistance is overboard - Keep in mind that resistance functions differently than how the brain intuits at first glance. It's like approaching the speed of light and requiring more and more input of energy to achieve that speed until at 99.9999... = c it's infinite energy. 80% resistance is HUGE, 95%+ might as well be actual immunity. Even 50% resistance is extremely good and DOUBLES your effective HP.

    Right now, with how pathetic fire is in the first place, you could just remove fire immunity outright and it'd hardly change anything. A fire resistance of between 20 - 50% would be more than enough for Queens/Ravagers to mostly ignore fire.

    Let me explain this with actual numbers:
    Take your HP value - let's say 100.
    Divide that by the inverse of your resistance value (e.g. 35% resistance = 0.65)

    100 / 0.65 = 153 Effective HP

    Now 80% resistance:
    100 / 0.20 = 500 Effective HP

    Now 95% resistance:
    100 / 0.05 = 2000 Effective HP

    99% resistance:
    100 / 0.01 = 10,000 Effective HP

    You see how that grows in a way that isn't really intuitive at a glance. Increasing the damage resistance from 80% to 95%, a change of 15% in the resistance value, increased the effective hitpoints by 400%. From 95% to 99%, a change of 4% in the resistance value, the EHP increased 500%. This is why you have to be very very careful balancing using resistance values. You may think a change of 5% in resist may be small - but it can have a much larger impact than you expect to see in practice. This is a mistake I actually saw a developer for planetside 2 make not too long ago - where the resistance values for one of the vehicles was tweaked some small % and it unintentionally quadrupled the vehicles EHP.
    Last edited by Boersgard; 02-17-2019 at 05:12 AM.

  9. #9
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    Welp. Guess that's a no.
    Last edited by Balance Asshat; 02-18-2019 at 11:12 PM.

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