Any counter to SADAR?

[CABAL]

To CABAL: that is a crap example. I suppose crusher, spitter, lurker, runner, prae, boiler, warrior, and any other class I missed that I got one shot rocket deathed from are also rocks. What class is the scissors? Is it the Ravenger? Can I play Rav and perma the sadar from 1.5 screens away? Is there some act of god play xenos can do on the sadar? The only time I ever got him somewhat alone he just blows up both of us and his teammates revive him afterwards.

Runner would be a "scissors" in that example. Too fast to hit and not worth to even waste a rocket.
Yes, nearly all of them die to direct hit AP up to 5 tiles away from SADAR. But guess what... SADAR is only one. How many defenders, runners, spitters, lurkers, praes, boilers, warriors and crushers is there in comparsion to SADAR specs?

Also, you are bringing up some fucking bullshit about "perma the sadars from 1.5 screens away". Is this telling me that SADAR can kill a beno offscreen? The same SADAR spec that has no magnification on his explosive weapon? The same SADAR spec that has a gun that is extremely innacurate past 5 tiles away from where he fires it? You are trying to imply that SADAR can reliably both shoot offscreen at a beno he has no way to see (outside of wearing a pred mask) and not miss the rocket that has major chance to fail even if it enters the tile you are on?

You either lie, or have barerly any knowledge about SADAR outside of a beno perspective. Yes, devs nerfed SADAR not so long ago. They removed scope and decreased accurate rocket range to 5 tiles. So SADAR spec can't kill you offscreen and he is very, very, very unlikely to kill you if you 6-7 tiles away from him.

Did I forgot to mention that there is only one SADAR spec? With limited ammunition. With great FF potential. For each one beno a competent SADAR spec kills, there is dozen marines that get directly, or indirectly killed by bald SADAR specs.

In 1 vs 1 fight with SADAR (like how often does that happen?) nearly every beno has adventage. All he has is one chance to hit you with AP rocket. If he misses, he dies. How much more would you like to nerf SADAR?

The counters I am looking for is what ANY xeno can do to, or at least what you can do to survive. Something like what I mentioned with the others. I never played SADAR myself so it may actually exist. Something like:

Dodge, literally fucking dodge. SADAR spec isn't a fucking sentry gun with 100% accuracy and rockets aren't hitscan.
"WSAD" is the fucking least you can do. Make him miss his rocket, then jump into the fucking action.

To lurkermain: I agree. All specialists should be capable of snagging kills, or contributing to it. Or at least affecting the battle lines. The sniper does a REALLY good job of pissing me off with flames or making sure I have to run far away when on low health even if they rarely kill.

Haha, so your ideal "balanced" spec is an annoying piece of shit, who can't actually kill by himself.

Oh Kane, where does this kind of people come from?

[Master Havoc]

Did I forgot to mention that there is only one SADAR spec? With limited ammunition. With great FF potential. For each one beno a competent SADAR spec kills, there is dozen marines that get directly, or indirectly killed by bald SADAR specs.

In 1 vs 1 fight with SADAR (like how often does that happen?) nearly every beno has adventage. All he has is one chance to hit you with AP rocket. If he misses, he dies. How much more would you like to nerf SADAR?

Haha, so your ideal "balanced" spec is an annoying piece of shit, who can't actually kill by himself.

SADAR is just one of 4 specialists, and just 1 of 100 marines. He and his GLer friend doesn't have to kill half the hive alone, which as far as I can see they currently do. Or maybe currently if they don't xenos always win? Hard to tell with this game's weird balancing.

obviously balance talks shouldn't be around SADAR in a 1v1 battle system. It is just not how the game works and shouldn't be balanced around it. I can't imagine how broken this game would be if he didn't need protection.

My balancing opinions come more from games I have a strong understanding of what is fair/unfair and what makes it fun to play. With that in mind the sniper is as far as I can tell one of the most balanced classes marines have. I have seen queen pushes halted because the xenos next to her caught on fire from the sniper and retreated early. Mixed with a fail shout and marine push and that sniper was a really great team player. Likewise if marines focused on stuns and focused fire on one xeno, a sniper could get the final blow with their scoped shot. Wow, in both cases it is like teamwork actually matters! Amazing, teamwork in a teamwork game. Then I look over at SADAR who runs in the middle of the marine group to solo some xenos and FF his own teammates. You did it SADAR! what a team player. More like the ball hog in basketball who when he fails his 3 point shots takes his team down with him.

Balancing options? Make it so he can either stun or do 70% of my life, or catch me on fire, not all 3 at once. Having no ammo is not fun for SADAR and a terrible way to balance. Give him more ammo and less of a chance to do all the work himself. Another option would be EVERY shot he FFs will perma the marines. Yea sure you get a super dangerous RPG, but if the team doesn't work around you, you are a detriment to your team, not a positive. More of a double edged sword. Oh and that T3 who came up to you and you want to trade your life for his? you can do that, but it will be your last xeno kill. Alas, I doubt I will get a say in balance, so hence why I was more focused on counters.

Also, you are bringing up some fucking bullshit about "perma the sadars from 1.5 screens away". Is this telling me that SADAR can kill a beno offscreen?

You either lie, or have barerly any knowledge about SADAR outside of a beno perspective.

The second is true, but in the case of what he can/cannot do, not the situations he runs into. I am a xeno main. Xeno's playstyle and decion making is remarkably close to Natural Selection/NS2 which I have thousands of hours on. It is probably why I got addicted to this server as soon as I played on it. If I go marines, it is as a doctor, shipside personel, or squad medic. I love the chaos and decision making in the medical side more than solo killing, for now. So I have seen the SADAR many times so far from either fighting him, or as a medic who probably has to save his life once he blows himself up.

The last 4 rockets from the SADAR have been from off-screen I don't know how far, with me at full or near full health, the rocket comes flying by and hits close to me, and I am either crit or near dead to where his allies can finish me off with more offscreen bullets while I am stunned. Two of the times I wasn't even close to being still. Based on your reply I know what I am saying sounds like complete bullshit, and from just saying my perspective it isn't very convincing. I can chalk it up to being extremely unlucky and maybe start recording/streaming myself so I have a video rather than mine vs others words.

[c4xmaniac]

SADAR and GL are terrible specs who should be replaced, Drevens idea of SADAR becoming a TOW team so the power is divided among multiple marines and takes time and teamwork to work well is probably the best solution without removing it from the game.

Also your complaint about off screen SADAR, if that’s what he’s doing, is a known exploit and is bannable.

[FoxyShibata]

SADAR and GL are terrible specs who should be replaced, Drevens idea of SADAR becoming a TOW team so the power is divided among multiple marines and takes time and teamwork to work well is probably the best solution without removing it from the game.

Also your complaint about off screen SADAR, if that’s what he’s doing, is a known exploit and is bannable.

I feel like it already requires a solid amount of Teamwork, though.

Unless you're using WP or some big ass OT rounds, you need at least 2 other marines buddying with you to actually finish off the ones that you stun.

[AlbertBlackwell]

SADAR and GL are terrible specs who should be replaced, Drevens idea of SADAR becoming a TOW team so the power is divided among multiple marines and takes time and teamwork to work well is probably the best solution without removing it from the game.

Also your complaint about off screen SADAR, if that’s what he’s doing, is a known exploit and is bannable.

GL?

Terrible?

Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh that's objectively wrong


SADAR has been nerfed for years on end, the SADAR already has teamwork elements as you can reload the launcher faster with a second man something around that might work but a TOW team in 2192 :/

[Stan_albatross]

GL and sadar have been slapped with more nerfs than I can count and still they reside rent free in xeno mains' heads

[Mightbearetard]

Make opressor grab instant. With no warning. That instakills you.

Watch home marines cry for the same thing a sadar. People are biased.

[Master Havoc]

Wait a minute: was I looking for a counter to a powergamer and his buddy OT who would make the most powerful rockets possible and then have him safely use them far away using exploits, over the course of a few rounds? Well that would take away a lot of the frustration as the real counter for someone not exploiting would be to either bait his rocket around his max range or to simply spit on him. Like a shotgunner, as a defender I would simply be forced into not stepping into his range, which is better than dying to a rocket I had .2 seconds to react to.

I think some of the complaints are still valid but at least he is more tolerable than I realized at the start of the creation of this post.

[Ttly]

I will take credit for making the gitlab suggestion for giving the GL high-throw (which didn't even exist back then) and RPG the miniscope.
At the time, those two used to be the WORST specs, nade FF galore, AT rockets barely even stunning explosion proof xenos, etc.

Right now, they're in a way better shape but NOT as OP as they used to be, rockets barely even gib or directly kill much either nowadays, its the stun that does the work.

But yeah, if you're a T1 and got rocketed, that sucks but that's still disporportionate to the cost of rockets to T1.
If it's relating to defender in particular, you're already hitting WAAAAY above a T1, sure your damage output might not be as high as say a robust red dog, but you can eat HUNDREDS of regular M41 bullets (if people insist on shooting at you) and even several buckshot PBs, flames aren't even good counter even if they ignore armor with how easy they are put out.

[Pigeon]

'member when SADAR had a 2x scope? 'member when it used to just kill basically everything, one AP rocket gibbing praes and ravs.