Do crushers really need Anti-body block?

[Rohesie]

But it's not 1v1. Literally I've had times where I would cut off a crusher in a gap and four other marines would be firing at it. But because of its crest and armor it would just tackle me because I'm too slow to stop it, stomp me, and charge out with almost no damage. I've seen this happen to MANY people. You have to have a DEDICATED team of five marines to take out a crusher, and thats only if the crusher cannot retreat. As in, it goes into a dead end. Because if there's any way for a crusher to get out it can just charge out with no risk.

What you are describing is marines not using proper tactics. Two or three marines are enough to kill a crusher, really. This one Big Red round Sleepy and me took out a crusher quickly as it charged us in the caves and got tangled in the mass of marines. Two pointblank buckshots from each of us was all it took. It was over in a matter of seconds, really. Just to name an example.

I'd also like to add that AP doesn't penetrate crusher/queen crest.

Yes it does. I've both played crusher enough to know you can't ignore AP as you can do regular ammo, and killed crushers aplenty with AP.

One particular ice round that comes to my mind is when I saw a crusher beating a cade and a baldie shooting at it with his regular-ammo pulse rifle. The crusher was rightfully ignoring the bursts because her armor tanked it nicely. After she healed and came back to break more cades I stepped in close and began to burst her with AP. Too late it realized that she was being sprayed with a much more deadly ammo, and when it did it was too late. I chased it and downed it as it tried to flee.

Unless if you are talking about an elite or ancient crusher. Can't say for sure, because those are also very rare. It takes hours for a crusher to reach old age.

[JJG]

Should the crusher be able to charge even with a marine trying to block the way. Yes! Definetely!!!
Should a crusher be more capable in 1v1 than literally any other T3 because it can just magically slow you to an absolute crawl and then stomp on you? Absolutely not!

The idea is good, but it seems like the actual implementation needs some work. A crusher shouldn't be able to robust a marine with a shotgun and a machette everytime without fail.

Edit: About the comment that the game is not a 1v1. Let's be honest here, a lot of the time it is a 1v1. Even when you are with a group of marines, a spitter can knock at least two out of the fight, a crusher can hit one marine once and then he is also out of the fight. All xeno's can stun people almost indefinitely. Yeah you might be in a group, but if everyone is lying on the floor stunned it might as well be a 1v1.

[Gray]

Yes it does. I've both played crusher enough to know you can't ignore AP as you can do regular ammo, and killed crushers aplenty with AP.

One particular ice round that comes to my mind is when I saw a crusher beating a cade and a baldie shooting at it with his regular-ammo pulse rifle. The crusher was rightfully ignoring the bursts because her armor tanked it nicely. After she healed and came back to break more cades I stepped in close and began to burst her with AP. Too late it realized that she was being sprayed with a much more deadly ammo, and when it did it was too late. I chased it and downed it as it tried to flee.

Unless if you are talking about an elite or ancient crusher. Can't say for sure, because those are also very rare. It takes hours for a crusher to reach old age.

I'm not sure, this happened about a month ago where I burst fired AP into a Crusher that was 2 tiles infront of me from behind a cade. The Crusher's crest was deflecting every. single. AP. bullet. while he just continued to slam the cade. This was on the almayer so it was pretty late into the round. I've also had queens delfect AP with their crests when they were facing in my direction.

A crusher that turns his back to you doesn't deflect AP at all, no.

[Rohesie]

I'm not sure, this happened about a month ago where I burst fired AP into a Crusher that was 2 tiles infront of me from behind a cade. The Crusher's crest was deflecting every. single. AP. bullet. while he just continued to slam the cade. This was on the almayer so it was pretty late into the round. I've also had queens delfect AP with their crests when they were facing in my direction.

A crusher that turns his back to you doesn't deflect AP at all, no.

The ones I mention tend to be Mature if not Young. In the Ice Colony example it was obviously facing me, as I was behind the cades, so their crest was up.

To reach Elite you'll have to play a long time, and probably as a roundstart xeno. Crusher evolution is really slow. And by then they may as well deflect AP when facing you. That sounds very fair to me. They'll still have zero armor against melee, pointblank or fire, though, no matter where they're facing.

[caleeb101]

Maybe you shouldn't 1v1 a literal rhino? just do some team work. I know you guys can do that.

The game is not only about winning and killing benos in 1v1. Christ.

Why do you assume people do that and then wonder why they have issues against it?

[Heckenshutze]

Maybe you shouldn't 1v1 a literal rhino? just do some team work. I know you guys can do that.

The game is not only about winning and killing benos in 1v1. Christ.

Had to ask, what's wrong with that?

It's a game, a Team deathmatch game in it's core; why is it bad for a player to feel the desire to robust the fuck out of whatever monster by himself? If I wanted to play something -and don't feel the desire to win- I'd play something like The Sims.

The word 'Roleplay' doesn't mean to play something not expecting or seeking to win. RP stands for "Act as a X character" in the most realistic way you can or the game tells you to. Nothing about not wanting to OOC win the game or play to win, if the objective of the Server was to force that chip into it's players brain then erase the Xenos and make extended rounds 24/7 and just make them RP around the ship until everyone logs out of boredom; because, as long there is another team to compete with, both sides will seek to win, it's human nature.

[Gnorse]

I'm staying neutral on this, but I'll go ahead and say this :
I have never seen this "anti-bodyblock" system being used as what it is. the only thing T3s use it for is to run towards a marine, PUSH THEM so they get stunned/slowed down and then tackle/slash/infect/whateverthefuck.

[Lorem123]

Yeah the fact that xenos can push marines in a direction is abused to a ridiculous degree. All anti bodyblock gets used for is to put marines in a bad position, not to stop marines from blocking xenos in.

But nerfing xenos rarely ever happens so I expect this to stick around for a while.

[Bancrose]

Throwing your body in the way is the best way to kill a crusher.

You risk getting tackled instantly and stomped, but usually there is plenty of boys around to just gang up and try to trap it.

[DefinitelyAlone0309]

Follow what Heinz said, but have one more dude right behind you in case you get tackled down so that Crusher can never escape, or it only somehow escapes with 1 HP because either the whole process is messed up or it had buddies to help pull it out

[Aestel]

The issue is that merely by being next to a crusher, and especially if its trying to attack you, you eventually get rooted to the ground for it to kill you.

[Asmodius]

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not saying this isn't a dumb feature that should be shouldn't be removed, because it should be

crushers with an iq above 75 usually dont fall for these tactics, theyre nigh invincible if they dont get cocky and literally just play safe

[Lorem123]

You had to shoot a crusher how many times with a pump shotgun at nearly point blank range to kill it? 6 times?
Real balanced. I saw a young crusher deflect a tank shell earlier today.

[MattAtlas]

You had to shoot a crusher how many times with a pump shotgun at nearly point blank range to kill it? 6 times?
Real balanced. I saw a young crusher deflect a tank shell earlier today.

That is from FULL HEALTH. Against a caste MEANT to tank. A MATURE T3 caste. Do you seriously want crushers to be wet toilet paper? Six buckshots is nothing if you can bodyblock a crusher because you'll usually not only have your gun, you'll also have others shooting it.

Maybe if crushers actually had any active abilities beyond stomp they wouldn't need an ungodly amount of health and armour to be relevant. Maybe if they had a single way besides tackle to knock down a bodyblocking marine they wouldn't need an ungodly amount of health + armour and the bullshit anti bodyblock meausres.

Just make the crusher actually able to knock down the guy bodyblocking them reliably without a shit RNG tackle and worsen their HP/defense. Done.

[Davidchan]

That is from FULL HEALTH. Against a caste MEANT to tank. A MATURE T3 caste. Do you seriously want crushers to be wet toilet paper? Six buckshots is nothing if you can bodyblock a crusher because you'll usually not only have your gun, you'll also have others shooting it.

Maybe if crushers actually had any active abilities beyond stomp they wouldn't need an ungodly amount of health and armour to be relevant. Maybe if they had a single way besides tackle to knock down a bodyblocking marine they wouldn't need an ungodly amount of health + armour and the bullshit anti bodyblock meausres.

Just make the crusher actually able to knock down the guy bodyblocking them reliably without a shit RNG tackle and worsen their HP/defense. Done.

Are you serious? Crushers can delimb multiple marines without even clicking on them. Crushers are immune to explosive stuns like claymores, mines and even CAS strikes. Mature crushers aren't that much of a time investment for xenos. Why would they need even more buffs when they can run down any marines, turn on a fucking dime and still maintain momentum while zig zagging. They don't even stun themselves anymore when colliding with walls and plasteel barriers, what possible need is there for them to have even more buffs? Their health is way to high especially combined with their armor, tackle rate, minimal use of plasma despite the large pool size and a stomp attack that crits marines in two hits. Hell queens were balanced by making them less like crushers. Let that sink in.

[MattAtlas]

Are you serious? Crushers can delimb multiple marines without even clicking on them. Crushers are immune to explosive stuns like claymores, mines and even CAS strikes. Mature crushers aren't that much of a time investment for xenos. Why would they need even more buffs when they can run down any marines, turn on a fucking dime and still maintain momentum while zig zagging. They don't even stun themselves anymore when colliding with walls and plasteel barriers, what possible need is there for them to have even more buffs? Their health is way to high especially combined with their armor, tackle rate, minimal use of plasma despite the large pool size and a stomp attack that crits marines in two hits. Hell queens were balanced by making them less like crushers. Let that sink in.

You literally ignored the part where I said they need active abilities and NERFS to their armour and health.

[Gnorse]

giving crushers active abilities at the cost of stats seems fair to me.

but for the love of god, don't bring back the AoE stun.

[Davidchan]

You literally ignored the part where I said they need active abilities and NERFS to their armour and health.

You missed the part about them having enough abilities as is and their armor/health needs to be nerfed as is.

[MattAtlas]

You missed the part about them having enough abilities as is and their armor/health needs to be nerfed as is.

Two abilities in total aren't """enough""" abilities. The caste needs to be less braindead, it shouldn't be literally W+MMB. I don't know why you're so opposed to crusher being changed to be less of a tank, which is (literally) what you want.

[Rohesie]

You had to shoot a crusher how many times with a pump shotgun at nearly point blank range to kill it? 6 times?
Real balanced. I saw a young crusher deflect a tank shell earlier today.

If he had actually pointblanked 3 shots would have been enough. Against a full-health tank.

[Omicega]

Vader is right. Point-blanking gets even more disgustingly effective if you have a BC. One BC PB with buckshot will crit a mature ravager - I would be surprised if it took more than two to crit a mature or even elite crusher.

[Sleepy Retard]

I really don't care they have anti body block. Even with it, most retard crushers die (which is 98% of them). The good ones don't need the anti body block anyways, we wouldn't kill them without it.

If there was something implement to babify and hug box crushers so they can't be body blocked, there's a serious problems. Many a time a body block simply doesn't work due to insane tackles. Remember - IF TWO OR THREE MARINES ARE ACTIVELY GETTING THEMSELVES KILLED TO PUNISH AN OVEREXTENDING XENO - PERHAPS ITS FINE AND THE XENO SHOULDN'T OF OVEREXTENDED.

You will not kill a crusher that doesn't over extend. It's a simple fact. Crushers that die are the ones who overextended, or in the rare case got killed defending the hive. Just because you're meant to smash barricades doesn't mean you should DO IT ALONE

[Karmac]

I only just found out this exists today and it's retarded make it go away ok thanks

https://gitlab.com/cmdevs/ColonialMarines/issues/4029