Staff Report : Dr.PNG

[Kesserline]

Your Byond Key: JeanManche

Your Character Name: Mark 'Echo' Kesserline

Their Byond key: Dr.PNG

Approximate time and date of the incident (Central Us Time for best results): Saturday 17th november (can't remember the hour, it was Ice Colony round, the hour must coincide with my last note, if you have the hour on the note)

Which Staff Protocols (http://www.colonial-marines.com/viewtop ... =57&t=5647) were broken: 6. PIN NOTES TO PLAYERS

Description of the incident:
Ice Colony Round.

► Show Spoiler

Me : Medic Delta
Person ahelping against me : Willy Red, Delta Engineer

Pushing down south through a 2x2 corridors with other marines.
Maint opened on the SW of us. I breached in it, PBing a lurker and got the upper hand in a 1v2 with the runner accompanying the lurker. I counted on marines pouring out of the hatch where I came from to ensure the kills.

Maint hatch got closed in my back, making me lose the momentum. I open it again. Runner comes back to harass me and tickle my boots.
Willy Red closes it again.

I open it again.
He closes it again.

Finally, I manage to open it and get through the hatch, instantly unleashing the fury of my fists upon Will Red's face, as he nearly sentenced me to death (he wanted to weld shut the hatch, with me behind it, he knew and saw me in the maint tunnel).
I punch him until he gets down, then throws some more punches and stopped.

He stood back on his feet, punched me back. It goes on a little, so I drew my knife and knifed him. He drew his knife and knifed me back. Xenos were coming from our south, and I started pulling back. He pursued me, keeping knifing me. Due to several factors :
1- Me going to crit due to the first encounter with Mr. Tickling Runner + the knife fight
2- The Xenos literally 10 to 20 meters south of us pushing us back in the corridor
3- The fact that he literally tried to sentence me to death (FFing is one thing, cutting off someone from any chance of rescue/survival is kinda harsh)

I drew my shotgun and PBed him once (not in the head). He insta died, and a medic took care of him, giving me time to heal myself back.

Dr.PNG probably answered the ahelp of Willy Red. I had to explain myself several times, literally using the same words repeatedly to make myself understood. I disliked particularly being directly accused of improper escalation and "inventing a random bullshit reason" (the quotation is not accurate, but we should recognize it in the logs) to PB another marine.

While it was clearly : 1. Fist. 2. FistVsFist. 3. KnifeVsFist. 4. KnifeVsKnife. 5.Firearm.

First of all : I tend to answer to griefers with grief, I got warned for that.
Here, it was a fellow marine that I liked, but that deeply fucked up ICly, and it was just an escalation purely ICly. No hard feelings or whatever OOCly, it was just IC.

At the end, Dr.PNG decides to let this down ICly, but kept the note on me.

As I was not officially warned, nor banned, and that the IC cause and the proper escalation of this matter was not denied by the involved staff, the note has no purpose to stay.

Evidence (screenshots, logs, etc):
Well, I got nothing. It's all in the logs, I didn't intend to make the report at the beginning.

How you would punish the accused: I just want the note to be removed and a more impartial stance to be adopted by Dr.PNG when he starts his investigation. Starting with thinking of someone being guilty might get problematic in the future, especially if the "guilty" person has to insist 3 to 4 times using facts just to convince not being the bad guy in the story.

[ThesoldierLLJK]

Logs:

The fight that started

► Show Spoiler

[10:18:36]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) punched Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red)
[10:18:37]EMOTE: Willy Red/Pinkledwrenis : <B>CPL Willy Red</B> cries out in pain!
[10:18:37]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) punched Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red)
[10:18:38]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) punched Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red)
[10:18:41]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) punched Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red)
[10:18:43]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) punched Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red)
[10:18:45]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) punched Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red)
[10:18:45]ATTACK: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) punched JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)
[10:18:47]ATTACK: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) punched JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)
[10:18:48]ATTACK: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) punched JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)
[10:18:49]ATTACK: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) punched JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)
[10:18:51]ATTACK: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) punched JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)
[10:18:53]ATTACK: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) punched JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)
[10:18:54]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) attacked Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) with M5 'Night Raider' survival knife (INTENT: HURT) (DAMTYE: BRUTE)
[10:18:54]ATTACK: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) punched JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)
[10:18:56]ATTACK: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) punched JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)
[10:18:57]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) attacked Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) with M5 'Night Raider' survival knife (INTENT: HURT) (DAMTYE: BRUTE)
[10:18:58]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) attacked Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) with M5 'Night Raider' survival knife (INTENT: HURT) (DAMTYE: BRUTE
10:19:00]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) attacked Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) with M5 'Night Raider' survival knife (INTENT: HURT) (DAMTYE: BRUTE)
[10:19:01]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) attacked Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) with M5 'Night Raider' survival knife (INTENT: HURT) (DAMTYE: BRUTE)
[10:19:03]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) attacked Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) with M5 'Night Raider' survival knife (INTENT: HURT) (DAMTYE: BRUTE)
[10:19:04]EMOTE: Willy Red/Pinkledwrenis : <B>CPL Willy Red</B> screams!
[10:19:04]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) attacked Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) with M5 'Night Raider' survival knife (INTENT: HURT) (DAMTYE: BRUTE)
[10:19:05]ATTACK: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) attacked Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) with M5 'Night Raider' survival knife (INTENT: HURT) (DAMTYE: BRUTE)
[10:19:09]ATTACK: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) attacked JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) with M5 'Night Raider' survival knife (INTENT: HURT) (DAMTYE: BRUTE)
[10:19:11]ATTACK: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) attacked JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) with M5 'Night Raider' survival knife (INTENT: HURT) (DAMTYE: BRUTE)
[10:19:12]ATTACK: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red) attacked JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline) with M5 'Night Raider' survival knife (INTENT: HURT) (DAMTYE: BRUTE)
[10:19:13]ATTACK: SOMETHING?? shot Willy Red (pinkledwrenis) with a the additional buckshot)
[10:19:13]EMOTE: Willy Red/Pinkledwrenis : <B>CPL Willy Red</B> screams!
[10:19:13]ATTACK: SOMETHING?? shot Willy Red (pinkledwrenis) with a the additional buckshot)
[10:19:13]ATTACK: Mark 'Echo' Kesserline (jeanmanche) shot Willy Red (pinkledwrenis) with a shotgun buckshot shell in the Underground Eastern Maintenance

I will pull PM logs tomorrow unless another mod/admin can get them.

[DrPng]

I guess i should've clarified that we have to keep notes on players for almost every interaction, so I put the note in with just a "talk" rather than a true warning because I deemed the entire situation IC beginning with Will. Also at the time I was investigating more and looking at VV logs for context which altered my conclusion.

[PinkledWrenis]

I am Willy Red. I feel it's important that I add my account of the situation.

For starters, you had no advantage kesserline. You were getting jacked up. You tried to take on a runner and lurker as a medic with no support. As well, I had been closing maintenance hatches as we pushed to stop marines from being flanked. If a door closing behind you in a fight where you're 1v2 with an "advantage" causes you to "lose momentum" there's something very wrong. As for you opening the hatch, that just never happened and I'm not sure why you say that happened. I was toggling the hatch open and close, trying to give you a window to disengage while stopping xenos from flooding into the hall with the rest of the marines. I didn't want to weld or bolt you in there, I wanted you safe with the rest of the marines instead of full unga mode as I know you're a valuable player.

As far as our altercation goes. I didnt throw a single punch until after you had me on the ground, beating me. I could understand you being miffed but you were alive. Throwing an angry punch is one thing but beating me on the ground is another.

I saw you baiting me into "proper escalation" and I played along, wanting to see if you'd go full dunga, which you did. You couldn't sort it out IC with your fists or words. You WANTED to kill me. After all that, I was still content to let it go. Additionally, I did not Ahelp. DrPng contacted me initially asking why I attacked you. My assumption is that you being a more well known player, he was trying look out for you and in turn discovered the situation.

[ThesoldierLLJK]

PM logs:
No ahelp was sent, so looks like he was observing and saw it

► Show Spoiler

[10:19:31]ADMIN: PM: Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan)->Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red): Why did you attack Mark?
[10:19:50]ADMIN: PM: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red)->Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan): He attacked me first. He started punching my ass, Punching him back and he pulls a knife.
[10:20:14]ADMIN: PM: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red)->Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan): He fucking shotgunned me instead of fighting like a man.
[10:21:28]ADMIN: PM: Pinkledwrenis/(Willy Red)->Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan): That was fucked up. So much for proper escalation.

[10:21:18]ADMIN: PM: Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan)->JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline): Excuse me, why did you decide to attack and kill Willy?
[10:22:22]ADMIN: PM: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)->Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan): He decided to shut me off a maint. With me fighting to death against a runner and a lurker in 1v2. He tried to close it 3 times, then I managed to break through. So I hit hiis face until he got down. Then, he stood up, and decided to retaliate. So I knifed him, because first for fist. Then, he took his own knife to k-
[10:23:30]ADMIN: PM: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)->Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan): Sorry, was fighting to survive a bit more. So.. He took his own knife and started to cut me. So I PBed him.
[10:23:52]ADMIN: PM: Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan)->JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline): Yeah, okay, well first of all, you decided to start a fight the led to another player getting PBed over a push and shove in a small hall way. You attacked him first with your fists and knife, and he retaliated in self defense. That's improper escalation for you.
[10:24:11]ADMIN: PM: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)->Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan): So wait a second
[10:25:09]ADMIN: PM: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)->Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan): He shut me off in a maint while I&#39;m fighting to survive. I managed to get off from that fight (not thanks to him) and just punched him. He started to PUNCH back. So, because we were LITERALLY dying in that corridor. I knifed him; Because it was a FIGHTING situation. Then, he knifed me back while pursuing me while I was already in pain crit speed. Sorry, but no choice to PB him.
[10:25:38]ADMIN: PM: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)->Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan): What I see is : Fist vs Fist then Knife Vs Fist (proper escalation) then Knife vs Knife. Then Firearm Vs Knife.
[10:26:16]ADMIN: PM: Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan)->JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline): No, because you decided to start a bullshit fight for no reason while there are literally killer aliens in front of you, does that make any sense at all?
[10:26:49]ADMIN: PM: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)->Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan): Bullshit fight for no reason : the guy tried to SHUT A MAINT OFF. WITH ME INSIDE. WITH 2 XENOS IN IT. WHILE I WAS FIGHTING THEM
[10:27:01]ADMIN: PM: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)->Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan): He repeatedly tried to CLOSE the maint while I was trying to ESCAPE it.
[10:27:31]ADMIN: PM: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)->Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan): The term &#34;REPEATEDLY&#34; shouldn&#39;t be ignored in that sentence.
[10:28:43]ADMIN: PM: Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan)->JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline): hmm, on second thought, i'll leave this IC for now, still the point remains, priortize over the benos rather than beating your comrades to death, I'll stick a note.
[10:28:58]ADMIN: PM: JeanManche/(Mark 'Echo' Kesserline)->Dr.png/(Daniel Sullivan): Solid copy.
[10:29:48]ADMIN: <a href='?priv_msg=[0x500002a]'>Dr.png</a>/(Daniel Sullivan) has edited jeanmanche's notes: Talked with him about escalation after he beat and knifed and Engineer for weilding a door blocking his escape. It ended with him PBing the engi with a shotgun.

So seeing that its left as IC, I think DrPng was trying to document what he did, even though all this stuff is saved in the logs. It wasn't really a punishment/warning persay against you Jean, and I think this just needs to be handled with a quick talk to Dr.Png about what to note and what not to note. As far as the note removed, that's not up to me.

[Kesserline]

If the note has no warning value, I have strictly no problem against this report being closed and the note remaining.

If it has a warning value, I am a bit bothered about keeping it while technically I didn't broke any rules.

@Willy, I didn't bait you into proper escalation; Baiting would mean malicious intent. I just followed ICly what my character would do if threatened to be sealed off from a corridor facing aliens. I appreciate you OOCly, that doesn't mean that IC situations may tend to have us against each other.

[DrPng]

It's my fault for not clarifying that the note does indeed have no true value hence not using the word warning specifically. Just a documentation like soldier said.

[Kesserline]

Then I have strictly no problem as conserving the note and having this report closed.

Thank you for your insight and your answers, I know you have more urgent things to do.

[Imperator_Titan]

Glad to see you two worked this all out. But I'm going to remove that note regardless, as no matter what kind of a note it is, it'll always have somewhat of a warning value.

Resolved - Note removed. Moderator has been spoken to regarding noting procedures.