Can we do something about the metarushes?

[Sixty40]

Operation Waterworld seems decent in theory if building on a bridge is impossible. Kinda makes crusher too op tho, honestly extend the beach and plains instead of the water, giving xenos some actual walls and cover, should work a bit better. I agree with every point Anderut makes and its so nice to see other players here that play both sides and see the inherent issues, and not just a bunch of xenomains and marinemains spouting their usual toxicity. People who main a side are the highest form of cancer on this server. The problem is xenos are only good midgame through the use of deathballs. Xenos will never be strong early game, and only stand a chance when the meta rush has lost too any causalities. If the tank crew is sharp, medics are reviving the dead, and cades are up like they should be, its GG. Usually its 120 marines vs 40 xenos on a usual game, and an 70 marine push with tank on LV is rough. I just, for the life of me, dont understand why the devs took the only map with anti metarush design, poked a hole right into the fog at Hydro, and then made it 3 tiles wide for the tank. Like what? Add a bunch of small holes instead so that marines can trickle through but not the tank, and youl see the metarush success on LV fall sharply while still allowing for action to be had and not everyone is stacked on bridge or twiddling thumbs

[lengord]

Metarushes is not the only problem, low RP although pain in the ass. And i think both this problems are related, it's all because of lack of time. You need to rush while xenos still weak if you want to win, otherwise marines chances for good ending going down tremendously. But often it ends up in long 4 hour round or 13.00 win. I don't like both of it, but between them i rather choose long round than fast win, because in 4 hour game sometimes i see pretty good rp, ( people have time to talk to eachother). The only two ways to stop metarush, first is put some obstacle for them (like fog on LV or blastdoors on prison and bigred, and as i notice only then people start to talk and rp(or after evac when they not rushing anywhere)) or what is way more effective imo large enemy forces (you can't metarush 40 xenos with dozen of mature t3).

About LRP, Imagine you come to watch movie in theatre alone, and there is (nice girl for example) seating beside you. You can talk to her (RP) in the begging of the movie (but if you late (in rush, 12.20 drop) you have no time to talk before start), then you can talk during the movie, but only if it's really boring (4 hours round) or in the end ( which is bad idea because you have sever case of amnesia and will forget her when you get out of theatre (end of round))

How to rework:
-Make marines not able to drop before ( 13.00 for example) (sort of not in orbit yet)
How it will affect: You have much more time to prepare and acquaint yourself with squad members ( sl or other command can iniciate Bb match, Boxing match, CQC training and much more).
. No metarush but slow proceeding, because marines will afraid of 30+ xenos with lot of mature t3
.More time for xenos to make decent hive and defence
. To make xenos not boring add some more survivors to deal with (pluss surv will be much more of the threat in large numbers, and hiding in lockers will not be the only way to stay alive)
.If marines will know their squad members, they will care much more about someone's death.
. If someone want just to unga and pew pew, he still can latejoin and not miss much of action(and he will not mess up the rp part for others)

[Heckenshutze]

With the current state of the game time is very valuable, late deployments end with xenos having fortified every inch of vital ground, well aged xenos and t3�s meaning that marines will just deploy to get wiped and evac before the 2 hour mark.

The endless cycle of early evac and beno stomping that it is experienced in low pop now will also be seen in high pop.

Besides who the fuck wants to stay so damn long on the ship? Marines after they all get their attachies and gadgets don�t walk to *inhale *exhale they want to deploy and kill some aliens, RP must be natural not forced, otherwise nobody will RP just for the sake of being a rebel

[lengord]

With the current state of the game time is very valuable, late deployments end with xenos having fortified every inch of vital ground, well aged xenos and t3�s meaning that marines will just deploy to get wiped and evac before the 2 hour mark.

I don't believe 80+ marine meatball with all spec and sg can be wiped so easily right after landing especially if they won't run off like unga and will work together to make good FOB

Besides who the fuck wants to stay so damn long on the ship? Marines after they all get their attachies and gadgets don�t walk to *inhale *exhale they want to deploy and kill some aliens, RP must be natural not forced, otherwise nobody will RP just for the sake of being a rebel

You always can skip the ship part simply by latejoin, although regular ss13 servers doesn't have many action and still playable (to be honest i didn't play regular servers much, so can be wrong on this part)

And i don't say my idea is good, but if no one tried this before, atleast few rounds can be played like this just to test thing and see what will happen

[CABAL]

I don't believe 80+ marine meatball with all spec and sg can be wiped so easily right after landing especially if they won't run off like unga and will work together to make good FOB


You always can skip the ship part simply by latejoin, although regular ss13 servers doesn't have many action and still playable (to be honest i didn't play regular servers much, so can be wrong on this part)

And i don't say my idea is good, but if no one tried this before, atleast few rounds can be played like this just to test thing and see what will happen

You are counting on Majority (to emphasise: MAJORITY) of players to work together and be competent.
Nerfing marines and buffing benos is not going to solve metarush, marine will metarush in that case too, but instead of first drop 12:25, you will have 13:00 with older benos. At this point we could only count on boredom on beno side in order to have a chance to win. Start playing PFC marines, stop playing beno for a while, then read your posts again.

[lengord]

You are counting on Majority (to emphasise: MAJORITY) of players to work together and be competent.
Nerfing marines and buffing benos is not going to solve metarush, marine will metarush in that case too, but instead of first drop 12:25, you will have 13:00 with older benos. At this point we could only count on boredom on beno side in order to have a chance to win. Start playing PFC marines, stop playing beno for a while, then read your posts again.

Ok, ok. I'm marine main by the way.

[CABAL]

Ok, ok. I'm marine main by the way.

Impostor. True Chad PFC Marine Main would never propose drop block to 13:00 without some beno nerfs.

There is need for "Golden Ratio". Between "MetaFoB" and "MetaRush". Hitting the lever far left will hurt not only marines, but benos as well with even more dull gameplay. Later deploys create more major problems than they are solving minors.

There is a "trick" to solve MetaRushing. Preventing metarushes is hard, nearly impossible, however as (probably) native Americans were saying: "If you can't beat your enemy, become his friend" (or something like that). Instead of fighting with MetaRush, embrance it.
Add like 3, or 4 good Hive spots on each map and let benos choose between them. Now marines have to guess where benos are, you can't Meta something you don't know, so they are free to rush whatever they want, however this incourages not rushing naturally, instead of "plastic" OOC restrictions and rules.
Make that each of those spots can be "closed down" by marines taking control of this area, something like activating super-powerfull turrets that will wipe any beno in split second (generally taking this spot out of beno control permanently, them being far away from LZ render them unesential for possible beno comeback/fight since they can be ignored, marines hiding inside doesn't matter if you only need to attack FoB, bait them out and fight them on "fair" grounds).

This, this is solution, it gives burden on Mappers and a bit on Coders, but varies the gameplay by making it more fun and it also gives marines objectives. Taking control of each and every "good hive spot" should give benefits to marines, so the game overall starts to be more tactical. CO's would have to create actual battle plans and more possibilities.

[Madventurer]

What would solve both mega-FOB and meta-rush issues is to give very compelling reasons for marines and xenos to hold objectives in the colony, rather than simply have two bases for both.

Currently, any fortifications by marines outside of FOB are just spots for retreats to regroup in, not serious defensive lines.

I'm still an advocate of both ticking DEFCON score and xenos more as faceless horde that doesn't stop, so I suggest having spots that give DEFCON score over time, and allowing xenos to have higher numbers that replenish fast.
So: Marines are given 2-3 locations with consoles that must be powered and accessed, at roundstart. They now have solid objectives. Intel gives more of these objective sites, along with all of the previous things. That means you have at LEAST two places to get more DEFCON *WITHOUT* IOs, who may very well be already dead in the average round. The sites wouldn't be too close to the LZs, of course. Big Red closest one would probably be in Admin.

Adding to this, roundstart delays such as fog play well with sites. You would have time to bunker down for both sides, while having a very good reason to do so. Of course, some people might find this boring, since xenos would have only handfuls of skirmishers. On the other hand, once xenos have reliable respawn system, they can afford to have those skirmishers yeet themselves into the marine force to slow down fortification of key locations, and identify them in the first place.

Example: Marines are given intel about consoles on Big Red: Adminstration and Offices. Both are along a reasonably common push line for marines, so they're quite likely to get taken anyways. Offices is more dangerous though. Later in the round, Dorms EVA room is revealed to be another. Quite a risky spot, but worth it?

[Pigeon]

The reason metarushes even exist is because giving aliens easier access to mature tier 3s means throughout the rest of the game you will face more mature tier 3s. Do you want a mature rav at 25 minutes or you want the marines to stall till 30-35 minutes so aliens can age their tier3s at least? Now you might be asking, 'why do xenos need mature tier 3s' answer is young tier 3s just plain suck. They are weaker, slower, and less tanky. Aliens can't as reliably defend with tier 3s.

As I said earlier add back the win messages, if marines don't get defcon 4 before winning marines loss and it xeno major as marines fail to understand the situation which just occurred and the aliens are allowed to spread to more worlds. The point of it is to force into the mindset of the marines to work with IOs to get that defcon 4 and explore areas of the map, get the dead, set up power, etc... So they can get there sweet sweet marine major message in the end. We don't have to add more barriers, we don't have to do crazy balance changes, just make it so marines actually do something beside ugna bunga into the alien hive for that 25 min queen kill.

EDIT: spelling errors

[Lauren Von Fusegana]

How to stop meta rushing. Make all maps procedural generated (that way people can actually use the maps in game instead of some prop holder for RP reasons), and you can't have meta rushes if no one knows the map~