I was just passing time to get over the boring briefing and start to do something. I don't read the chat during briefing because of all the spam, i was a engineer, also had a jtac key so even had to hear the POs fighting over who did the CAS and who was stuck in the Alamo, when i noticed, someone pointed at me and then the CPL came and killed me. If you just pushed me and took the nade away it would have solved things better and nobody would have cared.Originally Posted by Renomaki
Why wouldn't you pay attention during briefing?
Yes, they are boring a lot of the time, and oftentimes they can get predictable, but at the same time, it is still a good idea to be aware of what your squad is going to be doing. Moreso as an engineer, since you need to know how you are going to go about the situation on the ground and where you are going to be using most of your materials. Had you been paying attention, things would have turned out differently as well.
I also find it ironic that you didn't read chat due to spam, despite the fact that you were adding to the spam itself. Not a lot of fun having your chatbox be filled with garbage when you are trying to "hear" what people are saying.
I'm not going to justify my executing you in briefing, but at the same time, shit would have happened either way. If I sent MPs to deal with you, no doubt shit would have got stirred up and cause more disruptions (which wouldn't be the first time, as I have experienced). If I went to personally steal away your grenade, what is to say you wouldn't resist? You'd be surprised how much people will care about the littlest things, and I say this with experience. We had mutinies done over the dumbest things, and many a marine often hates authority of any sort to the point of doing everything in their power to make their lives hell (hence why MP is such an unpopular role, due to how people unjustly hate on them for just doing their job).
As I mentioned earlier, I assumed my execution of you would have taught you a lesson in respect, to do as ordered and to behave as a proper marine. But as always, it backfires, and here we are now, bickering about an execution that honestly still confuses me now.
Here's my technical take on this as a CO council member in accordance with other members.
First let's start by taking a look at the logs and notice the time difference between;
Briefing starting:
[15:55:52]ADMIN: Renomaki/(Reno 'Weenie' Story) used a megaphone to say: >Right, pay attention everyone, and pay attention good. I don't want anyone misunderstanding today's tasks<
>In this timeframe you activated the grenade 5 times.
You being told to stop:
[15:56:13]ADMIN: Renomaki/(Reno 'Weenie' Story) used a megaphone to say: >First off, STOP PLAYING WITH THE DAMN GREANDES<
>In this time frame you activated the grenade 7 more times.
Following that statement from the CO the next thing in the logs is a comment made by you:
[15:56:50]SAY: John Stitz/Enukar : I have a bad feeling
This shows that you were in fact attentive to what was going on and the situation around you.
>In this timeframe you activate the grenade 2 more times and 5 more times as the CO was speaking.
Your last activation of a training grenade after 14 more times after being told not to:
[15:57:27]ATTACK: John Stitz (enukar) primed M07 training grenade (JMP)
The difference there is about 1 Minute and 14 Seconds. More than enough time for you to follow that instruction.
The BE happened only 5 seconds later. As you noticed the CO walking up to you.
[15:57:33]ATTACK: Reno 'Weenie' Story (renomaki) shot Unknown (as John Stitz) () with a high-impact revolver bullet in the Briefing Area (JMP).
This leads me to the conclusion that you were doing something pretty dumb, and continued to piss off the CO after being ordered to cease and you got a response for it.
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
Now you have to understand that you were not BEd for simply "activating a training grenade", but because of your failure to follow a direct order from the CO and undermine his authority in his own presence by continuing it 14 more times non-stop through a timeline of 1 minute and 14 seconds, when you were told to cease. Your constant activation of the grenade and the message "I have a bad feeling" shows that you were present and aware of the situation.
The BE itself is an odd one, rushed and short-fused, which leaves much criticism to it.
Is it justified? After analyzing the logs and as much of the situation that I can see from here, it is justified even if it is considered as overboard or poor display by some.
You should've stopped when told to and that's a period. The best Reno could've done is taking the extra step to be more direct in ordering you to cease and pointing you out specifically for the sake of correctness and taking the incident outside of the grey area. Only then if you directly persisted under his direct authority should he have applied the BE.
Therefore I can not and will not vouch for any punishment on Reno, since he had his reasons at least and what you did is stupid. Next time follow direct orders from the CO more precisely and in a timely manner.
The best I can do is to leave this as a warning and advice for Reno to not rush the BE on people and be more considerate and especially level-headed on such situations and willing to take the extra step before taking definitive actions such as a BE. I hope to have your understanding Reno that such rash actions are not to be repeated and proper consideration is made before applying your BE privileges. That's your only fault.
While technically the CO can, I'm against briefing BE's because they almost always cause more problems than it's worth. The player in question can't complain if they openly disobeyed the CO. The CO is given the ability ICly to BE almost anyone for any real reason, however the OOC rules for BE are governed by logical action. CO, as with most whitelist, are still in charge of making the round run more smoothly and while BE will usually cause some turblance, it's their job to make sure it's done as cleanly and fairly as possible. I haven't seen any problems with Reno so this will be left at a warning to consider the outcome of doing a BE in a very public place.
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