Marine Law Discussion Thread

[CABAL]

While you can force marines to deploy, what is the point? If he does not want to die he will just wait for FOB to get sieged and flee on Alamo. You cannot force said marine to fight and he will, most likely, try to start mutiny because "They are sending us to our death! Let's kill command!" And permabrig, RP wise, is not just "We will release you after OP end" You can be executed, while you are in permabrig and will, most likely, face court after Almayer returns to dock. That means, that marine did not escape death, he, in fact, can be executed for desertion in next 5 or so minutes.

If MP give you max time on first offense without reason - ahelp it. If MP is breaking procedure - ahelp it. If MP is leaving you in brig alone - ahelp it. MPs have OOC protection, but they have more responsibilities. I would not say, that all timers are too long, and you will hardly miss all the fun, if you, for example, will insult officer at 12:10 and won't resist arrest. BY the way, in new Marine Law some punishments have been lowered.

And about removal of MPs. To be honest, I want to see what will happen, if such things as deconstruction of Almayer pre-briefing, fights, insubordination and so on will be handled by moderators, instead of MPs. Because I doubt, that anyone will give NCOs power just to beat up marines.

And what is the point in putting him in brig, investing time, food, MP's time who have to babysit him, appeals to command, faxes to High Command etc. All of that can be avoided by simply putting that fucker into DS, deploying with him and kicking him out of the DS just as it starts.
Even if such marine doesn't want to fight, he is now forced. Either he helps atleast in FoB defence, or risks quick slaughter from benos who easly swarm whole LZ after there is even the slightes breach. If FoB is not being sieged, he will be banned from returning to the Ship, so he can have his perma planetside.
At worst, it's just one problem out of the MP's head, best case scenario this marine actually helps, or even changes mind and starts to fight. Nothing to lose, everything to gain.

Also no marine can just start mutiny because Command sends order to deploy, even when benos are confirmed and running loose, killing squads. It's not valid reason, it starts to be when Commands gives ridiculous orders, like deploying what is left of marines vs 40 benos, or something like that. Even then, he needs 4 more marines and even then he needs more since 5 marines can easly be defeated by MP's and command combined.

MP's also deserve no respect, because they never earned any. The fact that this role has nothing to do after 12:30 is just insult to injury and OOC protection just attracts pure grieffers. I tried MP few times. It's more boring that being ignored CL, or doctor during low pop where autodocs can handle 90% of patients.
Things like breaking procedure, or max timing can't be easly proven to staff. To excuse any kind of procedure is to simply say that they "tried to run away". Bang, explained any silent taser, or stunbatton, since there are no logs of players walking.
Max timing on first offence? It's literally up to your choice if you want max, or min, no rules against it.

MP's should be harshly reworked.

In short: MP's don't have anything to do after 12:30. MP's have OOC protection. Because of those two things, they attract bad kind of players and only them. Marine Law at current state also needs a bit of tunning.

[RaddishRed]

And what is the point in putting him in brig, investing time, food, MP's time who have to babysit him, appeals to command, faxes to High Command etc. All of that can be avoided by simply putting that fucker into DS, deploying with him and kicking him out of the DS just as it starts.
Even if such marine doesn't want to fight, he is now forced. Either he helps atleast in FoB defence, or risks quick slaughter from benos who easly swarm whole LZ after there is even the slightes breach. If FoB is not being sieged, he will be banned from returning to the Ship, so he can have his perma planetside.
At worst, it's just one problem out of the MP's head, best case scenario this marine actually helps, or even changes mind and starts to fight. Nothing to lose, everything to gain.

Also no marine can just start mutiny because Command sends order to deploy, even when benos are confirmed and running loose, killing squads. It's not valid reason, it starts to be when Commands gives ridiculous orders, like deploying what is left of marines vs 40 benos, or something like that. Even then, he needs 4 more marines and even then he needs more since 5 marines can easly be defeated by MP's and command combined.

MP's also deserve no respect, because they never earned any. The fact that this role has nothing to do after 12:30 is just insult to injury and OOC protection just attracts pure grieffers. I tried MP few times. It's more boring that being ignored CL, or doctor during low pop where autodocs can handle 90% of patients.
Things like breaking procedure, or max timing can't be easly proven to staff. To excuse any kind of procedure is to simply say that they "tried to run away". Bang, explained any silent taser, or stunbatton, since there are no logs of players walking.
Max timing on first offence? It's literally up to your choice if you want max, or min, no rules against it.

MP's should be harshly reworked.

In short: MP's don't have anything to do after 12:30. MP's have OOC protection. Because of those two things, they attract bad kind of players and only them. Marine Law at current state also needs a bit of tunning.

Yes, we should let mods handle all shenanigans with OOC punishments.

Don't break the law, don't get punished. ML is just too easy to not break, if you want to fuck about not doing anything Bee station is down the server list I believe.

Don't insult people just because you don't like the role they picked.

edit: spelling

[CABAL]

Yes, we should let mods handle all shenanigans with OOC punishments.

Don't break the law, don't get punished. ML is just too easy to not break, if you want to fuck about not doing anything Bee station is down the server list I believe.

Don't insult people just because you don't like the role they picked.

edit: spelling

Less OOC punishments, MP reworked, not removed.
Currently calling benomains bad names is just a meme, calling people bad names who main MP's and this style appeals is not a meme and valid concern about how they play.

If somebody want to main MP in current state, Vore Station is down on the list.

[RaddishRed]

Less OOC punishments, MP reworked, not removed.

MP are a tool that enables less OOC punishment, they have OOC protection from being ganged on or murdered by marines because people don't like being told they can't do a thing. I'm all for removing maxtime punishments if some sort of punishment escalation is implemented.

[alexpkeaton]

If MP give you max time on first offense without reason - ahelp it. If MP is breaking procedure - ahelp it. If MP is leaving you in brig alone - ahelp it. MPs have OOC protection, but they have more responsibilities. I would not say, that all timers are too long, and you will hardly miss all the fun, if you, for example, will insult officer at 12:10 and won't resist arrest. BY the way, in new Marine Law some punishments have been lowered.

And about removal of MPs. To be honest, I want to see what will happen, if such things as deconstruction of Almayer pre-briefing, fights, insubordination and so on will be handled by moderators, instead of MPs. Because I doubt, that anyone will give NCOs power just to beat up marines.

This. PLEASE ahelp MPs who break the rules regarding marine law or brigging procedure. Ahelp me if I break the rules as an MP. We're required to follow the rules and marine law.

And admins, please remove MPs for a bit and instead do things the way you do it for xenos and impose OOC punishments like jobbans for insubordination and chucklefucking. Maybe the mere possibility that a marine might get brigged for a mere 15 minutes (if the MPs even find them) will suddenly seem more palatable than dealing with the bwoink brigade and appealing on the forums.

All you really need to do to avoid the brig is to wait twenty minutes until you get down to the surface to chucklefuck. All you need to do. 99% of all crimes on the surface never get you brigged. Those that want to be the center of attention at the briefing will become the center of attention in the brig, I'm not sure why that is surprising or infuriating. If you LRP and interfere with an arrest because you thought the chucklefucking was funny and they shouldn't be brigged, well you might also have a bad time ... for all of 20 minutes or so. Don't commit crimes on the Almayer, don't get brigged. Simple as that. Team Deathmatch simulator^TM down there, RP simulator^TM up here, that's pretty much how it is until the dropship crashes. If you want to stay in the RP simulator, don't be surprised when you get held to RP standards like being expected to play a role and follow the law. If you desert you will get brigged for it, again why the hate mail on this topic?

I am fully in favor of reducing consequences for certain crimes that are overused and overpunished. Penalties for destruction of property come to mind. That can technically be up to 30 minutes but really should max at 10. If you do something ridiculously destructive it will likely carry a more severe charge anyway. Trespassing max could be curbed in the same way. Assault minimum could be 10 minutes instead of 15 but is otherwise priced right. We don't need Hooliganism and Disorderly Conduct as separate charges. Disorderly between 5 and 15 is fine. I've never once brigged for failure to follow procedure but believe that should require two separate warnings before any brig time and even then 5 minutes. Intoxication should simply require the individual be escorted to medical and sleepers should have dialysis (is that really not a thing on CM? if not then maybe the CMP's locker could spawn with pills to treat intoxication). Theft can be 5 to 15 instead of 10 to 30.

I think insulting a superior and insubordination and neglect of duty and desertion should stand. Resisting arrest should go up 5 to 10 minutes in my opinion. First of all, I've never seen someone actually brigged for insubordination that I can recall. I've seen more people wanted for it than any other crime but never seen anyone brigged for it. Why? Because it happens from the surface typically. Same with disrespecting an officer which I've only seen one character brigged for who also happened to be my CL character in my very first CM round, which I should have ahelped I realized later. However, the mere fact of having those crimes help us in the RP simulator feel good about having an immersive experience so we can talk about the sentence you would get if we could ever find a way to bring you in for it from the Team Deathmatch simulator.

[RaddishRed]

Less OOC punishments, MP reworked, not removed.
Currently calling benomains bad names is just a meme, calling people bad names who main MP's and this style appeals is not a meme and valid concern about how they play.

If somebody want to main MP in current state, Vore Station is down on the list.

Oof, editing your reply like that after already being replied to is really low. I see there is no point in debating this with you any further as you don't seem to grasp the concept of "don't do bad thing, don't have bad thing happen", besides your "lemme LRP in peace, fuck the MP players!" argument.

[Troika]

What law, if any, does pegging an MP with an egg fall under?

[RaddishRed]

What law, if any, does pegging an MP with an egg fall under?

Hooliganism, it'd probably end with a warning or NJP/5 min in the brig if you threw A LOT of eggs.

[Takyon]

Give marines antags that fuck shit up on the Almayer and on the ground, gives MPs something to do.

Some Examples:

Hostile/Malfunctioning synthetics
Marines working for a foreign government
Spies
Revolutions?
Communists
Hostile Companies that target W-Y sympathisers

[DavidChan]

Hooliganism, it'd probably end with a warning or NJP/5 min in the brig if you threw A LOT of eggs.

You know for a damn fact the MPs will charge you assault for every egg, and likely Theft for the eggs or Damage to Govt Property. And of course resisting arrest even if they never declared the arrest and just tazed you.